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[baldgriff]

You have to call as there is no guarantee that he has an over pair. That is a continuation bet, not a bet trying to move you out.


SO I would likely have to raise, unless you feel he has the over pair.

[DMT]

I raise $8000. Folded around to the original raiser. He called.

Flop: 3h 8d 5c

He bet out $12,000. Total whiff for me...this could get expense, or I fold it like a cheap suit.

You have to at least call. His bet is small enough that he can get away from it if you shove, so that is decent play as well. Even if he has a pair you've got 6 outs and since you re-raised he might put you on a monster. Or he could be trying to induce you to shove. Tough call, but you can't just fold IMO.

[In the Corn]

I called. The turn was the 10h.

! tired bets $15000
! ITCs Running Aces is next to act, $15000 to call
! Unlimited raises
! Pot size: $76100
! Next timeout set for Fri, 08 Feb 2013 15:15 PST
! Betting round: 3
! Board: 3h 8d 5c 10h ?
+-+----------------------------+--------+--------+------+----+--------+
|#| Name |Bankroll| Action |Status|Pot#|Pot Size|
+-+----------------------------+--------+--------+------+----+--------+
1| Ben Irving | 69200 | 300 |folded| | |
3|D> ITCs Running Aces | 41900 | 28000 | | | |
4| Sir Barlow | 163675 | 1300 |folded| | |
5| ICBlues | 97250 | 2300 |folded| | |
6| kettledrum | 86075 | 300 |folded| | |
7| Non Sequitur | 56525 | 300 |folded| | |
8| tired | 41475 | 43000 | | | |
9| Emiras | 13925 | 300 |folded| | |
10| Un | 32950 | 300 |folded| | |

Looks like I'm going to call again.

[johnnya24]

I called. The turn was the 10h.

! tired bets $15000
! ITCs Running Aces is next to act, $15000 to call
! Unlimited raises
! Pot size: $76100
! Next timeout set for Fri, 08 Feb 2013 15:15 PST
! Betting round: 3
! Board: 3h 8d 5c 10h ?
+-+----------------------------+--------+--------+------+----+--------+
|#| Name |Bankroll| Action |Status|Pot#|Pot Size|
+-+----------------------------+--------+--------+------+----+--------+
1| Ben Irving | 69200 | 300 |folded| | |
3|D> ITCs Running Aces | 41900 | 28000 | | | |
4| Sir Barlow | 163675 | 1300 |folded| | |
5| ICBlues | 97250 | 2300 |folded| | |
6| kettledrum | 86075 | 300 |folded| | |
7| Non Sequitur | 56525 | 300 |folded| | |
8| tired | 41475 | 43000 | | | |
9| Emiras | 13925 | 300 |folded| | |
10| Un | 32950 | 300 |folded| | |

Looks like I'm going to call again.

If he can fire twice you probably gotta give it up.

This is why you shoulda shipped

[DMT]

If he can fire twice you probably gotta give it up.

This is why you shoulda shipped

Yea, if you're going to call again you might as well shove because you'll only have $26K left anyways.

[baldgriff]

Yup you either push or you fold now. Your call essentially declared BIG A.. Hes at a minimum saying he isnt afraid of your BIG A. so you either come over the top to try and push him off, or fold.

[johnnya24]

Yea, if you're going to call again you might as well shove because you'll only have $26K left anyways.

If they fire twice in this spot it's almost never a straight up bluff (unless they have a huge draw ... there was no flush possible on the flop) ... probably a mid-pair ... 88 or something like that. I don't believe 88 will fold to a shove ... it won't be an easy call, but it's hard to fold.

I don't like this small ball play style of play preflop with ITC's passive style ... not at this stage of the tournament. Aggressive players will just blow him away or take him to valuetown. He's just gonna call off with marginal holdings in bad spots post-flop (like this), and he has to keep hitting big hands to stay alive. The net result will almost always be seeing his chip stack disintegrate.

IMO ITC needs to bail on this if he fires again and change up his preflop style. Decent hand ... ship it. Try and get lucky and chip up or chip out. This is moving time in a tourney ... always best to give yourself a shot of moving up to the top rather than just surviving (especially since I don't see ITC running 2 and 3 barrel bluffs).

Passive-aggressive isn't the best style of poker, but it can be effective if employed correctly.

[In the Corn]

Folded to play another day...just not the Q-3 I was just dealt.

[baldgriff]

You had too.

[johnnya24]

Folded to play another day...just not the Q-3 I was just dealt.

You're passive style of play can keep you alive, and if you catch a few hands, you can stay healthy. But when the blinds start to kick in, you need to change-up. You can't change-up post flop, because (a) the blinds are too big and you get pot committed too easily, and (b) passive players have problems being aggressive post flop, and when they do, it isn't always in the best spots. there's no point playing and just waiting hit a huge hand or die.

If I were you, I'd bring hyper preflop aggression into your game for this stage of a tourney and beyond. It's the easiest adjustment to make. Start shipping it in these spots ... AK versus a pf raise is a great spot to gamble for a huge pot. Forget about flops unless you have a good chip stack and can fish with small pairs of s-cons.

It simplifies the game, and gives you a gamblers shot of actually winning the tourney, or at the least, getting a big chip stack.

[heyelander]

What's my play here? I know I need to see what happens before me, but new hand dealt, I'm third to act with

Heye = 7c 7d

HAND IN PROGRESS
! The Sicilian is next to act, $2000 to call
! Next timeout set for Fri, 08 Feb 2013 12:00 PST
! Pot size: $5700
! Board: ? ? ? ? ?
+-+----------------------------+--------+--------+------+----+--------+
|#| Name |Bankroll| Action |Status|Pot#|Pot Size|
+-+----------------------------+--------+--------+------+----+--------+
1|D threeputts | 152700 | 300 | | | |
3| Joshua Koppelman | 67500 | 1300 | | | |
4| Chris Fowlkes | 47200 | 2300 | | | |
5|_ The Sicilian | 71125 | 300 | | | |
6| Kevin Yeh | 75825 | 300 | | | |
7| heyelander | 60300 | 300 | | | |
8| Liz Caplan | 90525 | 300 | | | |
9| Virginia Slims | 49300 | 300 | | | |
10| Dean Martin | 282675 | 300 | | | |
+-+----------------------------+--------+--------+------+----+--------+

[DMT]

If they fire twice in this spot it's almost never a straight up bluff (unless they have a huge draw ... there was no flush possible on the flop) ... probably a mid-pair ... 88 or something like that. I don't believe 88 will fold to a shove ... it won't be an easy call, but it's hard to fold.

I don't like this small ball play style of play preflop with ITC's passive style ... not at this stage of the tournament. Aggressive players will just blow him away or take him to valuetown. He's just gonna call off with marginal holdings in bad spots post-flop (like this), and he has to keep hitting big hands to stay alive. The net result will almost always be seeing his chip stack disintegrate.

IMO ITC needs to bail on this if he fires again and change up his preflop style. Decent hand ... ship it. Try and get lucky and chip up or chip out. This is moving time in a tourney ... always best to give yourself a shot of moving up to the top rather than just surviving (especially since I don't see ITC running 2 and 3 barrel bluffs).

Passive-aggressive isn't the best style of poker, but it can be effective if employed correctly.

I completely agree...I was also agreeing in that earlier post with your recommendation to fold. I think our earlier disagreement was basically that I thought players should have shifted into this gear back then while you were arguing for a more, ahem, cautious approach. But despite the length of time it was only a few rounds ago that we were disagreeing. Glad to see you come around so quickly.

[DMT]

What's my play here? I know I need to see what happens before me, but new hand dealt, I'm third to act with

Heye = 7c 7d

HAND IN PROGRESS
! The Sicilian is next to act, $2000 to call
! Next timeout set for Fri, 08 Feb 2013 12:00 PST
! Pot size: $5700
! Board: ? ? ? ? ?
+-+----------------------------+--------+--------+------+----+--------+
|#| Name |Bankroll| Action |Status|Pot#|Pot Size|
+-+----------------------------+--------+--------+------+----+--------+
1|D threeputts | 152700 | 300 | | | |
3| Joshua Koppelman | 67500 | 1300 | | | |
4| Chris Fowlkes | 47200 | 2300 | | | |
5|_ The Sicilian | 71125 | 300 | | | |
6| Kevin Yeh | 75825 | 300 | | | |
7| heyelander | 60300 | 300 | | | |
8| Liz Caplan | 90525 | 300 | | | |
9| Virginia Slims | 49300 | 300 | | | |
10| Dean Martin | 282675 | 300 | | | |
+-+----------------------------+--------+--------+------+----+--------+

How has the big-stack been playing. From the button, he's likely to have a wide range of calling hands and might even re-raise if he's an aggressive player. I would probably just call here and hope to hit trips or a low flop. If there is a raise behind you, that's not a difficult call to make and I would not be afraid of shoving if the button--or any other player who's been very aggressive--tries to bully.

[heyelander]

Big stack just doubled up last hand by shoving 70k pre flop after he limped ($2000) in (after 2 other limpers) with A4 off and the SB raised to $12000.

SB had JJ

flop was 4d As 9d (ouch).

[johnnya24]

Big stack just doubled up last hand by shoving 70k pre flop after he limped ($2000) in (after 2 other limpers) with A4 off and the SB raised to $12000.

SB had JJ

flop was 4d As 9d (ouch).

I hope ITC is taking notes ... this is how you win tounrey's