World Cup 2014

[johnnya24]

It's been a fun discussion about USA/CONCACAF. In four years we'll forget we had it, and start all over again!

... and of course it's the Sports Bar, so we ended up back where we started without anything changing.

[Lurker765]

It would have been sad if the team that scored two goals in their final four games won the tournament.

[hacko]

I really enjoyed this World Cup . Esp when we had a rooting interest in it but even after US was out I kept watching. Unfort now I have to wait 4 years to get revved up again. I will take more of an interest in the qualifying games tho. Guess I have to settle for Johnny football and lebron until then

[baldgriff]

Messi as MVP - what a choke....... Oops I mean joke. The guy couldnt shoot on net to save his life after pool play.

[Mithrandir]

Messi as MVP - what a choke....... Oops I mean joke. The guy couldnt shoot on net to save his life after pool play.

I guess this ends the discussion of him being the greatest of all-time?

[Igor]

I have read, and bit my tongue for weeks on Johnny's Concacaf opinions.

[johnnya24]

I guess this ends the discussion of him being the greatest of all-time?

You aren't alone in saying this. The BBC panel were asked the same question sort of question: because Messi didn't win the world cap, I suppose he cannot be consider in the same league as Maradona and Pele? They all agreed.

So to clarify, if Palacio or Higuain would had have scored their easy chances, Messi would be the greatest. But because they missed, he isn't? That's just stupid IMO.

So let's just forget about the last 8 years of peerless mastery of the game ... all because he missed one reasonably difficult chance against the best goalkeeper in the world - Neuer will be a candidate as best of all time when his career finishes. He was completely exhausted after a long injury plagued season at Barcelona, and at the same time he had to carry a team of "underachievers" on his shoulders. I know it's hard calling them underachievers when they made the final, but Argentina have possibly the best front line in the tournament ... and they never turned up all tournament ... Messi kept them in the tournament early on ... without Messi they might never have made it out of their group:

Messi, Aguero, Di Maria, Higuain, Lavezzi ... the richest club team in the world could not afford to buy that lot. Two of them were injured (Di Maria and Aguero) and the other two sucked (Higuain and Lavezzi).

We never seen the best of Messi in this WC. He was a yard down in pace, and didn't have the legs to run for 90 minutes. But even injured and fatigued he carried his team to the final. That in itself is a huge achievement IMO.

That said, James Rodriguez of Columbia was the player of the tournament. Not Messi. He even looked embarrassed taking the trophy.

[johnnya24]

I have read, and bit my tongue for weeks on Johnny's Concacaf opinions.

That's a long time to bite your tongue

Really not sure what's so controversial about my CONCACAF opinions considering they are based on the betterment of the game in and for the USA.

Let's have it then ...

[Mithrandir]

You aren't alone in saying this. The BBC panel were asked the same question sort of question: because Messi didn't win the world cap, I suppose he cannot be consider in the same league as Maradona and Pele? They all agreed.

So to clarify, if Palacio or Higuain would had have scored their easy chances, Messi would be the greatest. But because they missed, he isn't? That's just stupid IMO.

So let's just forget about the last 8 years of peerless mastery of the game ... all because he missed one reasonably difficult chance against the best goalkeeper in the world - Neuer will be a candidate as best of all time when his career finishes. He was completely exhausted after a long injury plagued season at Barcelona, and at the same time he had to carry a team of "underachievers" on his shoulders. I know it's hard calling them underachievers when they made the final, but Argentina have possibly the best front line in the tournament ... and they never turned up all tournament ... Messi kept them in the tournament early on ... without Messi they might never have made it out of their group:

Messi, Aguero, Di Maria, Higuain, Lavezzi ... the richest club team in the world could not afford to buy that lot. Two of them were injured (Di Maria and Aguero) and the other two sucked (Higuain and Lavezzi).

We never seen the best of Messi in this WC. He was a yard down in pace, and didn't have the legs to run for 90 minutes. But even injured and fatigued he carried his team to the final. That in itself is a huge achievement IMO.

That said, James Rodriguez of Columbia was the player of the tournament. Not Messi. He even looked embarrassed taking the trophy.

I haven't seen Messi play all that often, but from what i have seen when i have been able to watch him, he is definitely in the discussion of GOAT.

Obviously we never got to see Pele play and he always had superb players surrounding him. I remember very little of seeing Maradona play and don't know what the quality of his teammates on Argentina was like in his World Cups.

I didn't get to see much of Messi this WC, but he did score some big time goals...

[johnnya24]

I haven't seen Messi play all that often, but from what i have seen when i have been able to watch him, he is definitely in the discussion of GOAT.

Obviously we never got to see Pele play and he always had superb players surrounding him. I remember very little of seeing Maradona play and don't know what the quality of his teammates on Argentina was like in his World Cups.

I didn't get to see much of Messi this WC, but he did score some big time goals...

IMO there is so much emphasis on the World Cup in the GOAT debate. In the past the WC was the only event that had blanket global coverage. So most of the footage we have to Pele and Maradona is from World Cup's. Even with Maradona who played from the late 70's to the mid-90's, there isn't much footage of his exploits at Barcelona and Napoli. There is very little footage of Pele when he played in Brazil ... but his stats are amazing.

That's not the case anymore. Practically every game from every big league has 15 cameras at the grounds. All Barcelona games are beamed live all over the world. So why are pundits holding to this notion that players have to do it at the World Cup or else ... I suppose tradition is hard to shake, and sports pundits love following the herd ... we all love a good sports cliche!

No-one would ever think of dismissing Ted Williams as an all-time great because he failed to post amazing World Series stats. It's a team game, there's only so much one man can do.

[Pogues]

That said, James Rodriguez of Columbia was the player of the tournament. Not Messi. He even looked embarrassed taking the trophy.

Colombia. Just saying. Being from Columbia, PA...it bugs me when the country is misspelled.

[Judge Jude]

my brother went to Columbia U, the NY Ivy League school. he still works there, 40 years later.
his daughter wound up going to a North Jersey HS called "Columbia"
I spent over an hour Sat nite talking to a close colleague of mine from North Jersey who is from - yep, Colombia. he was down there for the World Cup in fact

...............

"Obviously we never got to see Pele play and he always had superb players surrounding him."

uh, I went to a number of Cosmos games in the 1970s at Giants Stadium when Pele was playing, and yeah, Giorgio Chinaglia, Franz Beckenbauer, Carlos Alberto, etc
#justsayin

[DMT]

I agree, the people blaming Messi for Argentina not winning are complete idiots. I haven't followed the game long enough to have an informed opinion on the GOAT, but I can't think of anyone of this era I'd put ahead of him. And considering that he carried his team to the finals, why isn't he deserving of the MVP? James Rodriguez was incredible and he was awarded as such with the Golden Boot. I'm not saying Messi should have won it, but he certainly belongs in the conversation. His impact on every game was massive and his team had several opportunities to win it.

[Mithrandir]

my brother went to Columbia U, the NY Ivy League school. he still works there, 40 years later.
his daughter wound up going to a North Jersey HS called "Columbia"
I spent over an hour Sat nite talking to a close colleague of mine from North Jersey who is from - yep, Colombia. he was down there for the World Cup in fact

...............

"Obviously we never got to see Pele play and he always had superb players surrounding him."

uh, I went to a number of Cosmos games in the 1970s at Giants Stadium when Pele was playing, and yeah, Giorgio Chinaglia, Franz Beckenbauer, Carlos Alberto, etc
#justsayin

You can't compare Pele in the 70's to Pele in the 50's and 60's.

[bryanbutler]

You can't compare Pele in the 70's to Pele in the 50's and 60's.

sure you can. he was worse in the 70's.