Dogs in Public

[Teenwolf]

I guess if you are hurtful to others on purpose, then no, that's not technically inconsiderate...

I stand corrected?

Nailed it.

Being an asshole on purpose is not inconsiderate, and GITH is certainly not inconsiderate.

I admit that I'm often the asshole, on here and at times in real life. I send PM's to apologize when i cross the line, and will publicly fall on my sword whenever i hurt someone, intentionally or not. I think it's a crucial component to being an adult, taking accountability. GITH's constant assertion that he's the most accountable, most self-aware person, while also admitting to intentionally harassing people to hurt them is the definition of an unaware and unaccountable asshole. Further, those who revel in the distribution of suffering are top tier assholes.

I've attempted to coax an apology from GITH in the past, so that I can move on from his childish and unwarranted attacks on me. I never ever expect to receive one. Real accountability, that f'n guy.

This thread is gold. Thanks to GITH for starting it.

[Gregg]

Nice little story, but irrelevant.

If you don't NEED to have your animal in the store (service) then having them with you is simply because you WANT to have them with you. You're putting your desires to do what YOU want over the consideration of others.

You're just being inconsiderate, thoughtless and/or selfish--which is your right, just own it--to try and defend that behavior is entitlement--saying that others who point out your behavior are just trying to "control" you (or the animal) is a tired trope used by those not wanting to be called out (cancelled, PC etc)

I'm not crabby--My right to walk through a store unfettered supersedes your right to walk your dog down the same aisle I'm shopping in.

BTW you keep ignoring the fact some folks are allergic to dogs--but fuck those crabby, controlling, entitled dog haters right?

Before I ever went into a store with my dog, I looked up dog friendly stores. There were much more than I ever imagined. Why would these retailers allow dogs in their stores? Because it is good for business.

We both like cigars. If a good restaurant opened near you that allowed cigar smoking would you go? I would. It would be fun and a treat. Would I try to smoke in a non smoking business, of course not. I would expect those that do not tolerate cigar smoke to stay away from the new cigar friendly restaurant. Not try to go there and complain they have allergies.

For me it is the same. Places that allow dogs, if I am in the mood I will take them up on that. I will also tell you that no one will have a problem with my dog's behavior or our manners. If these places change their minds I will not be bringing my dog. By the way, several of the dog friendly places ask me if it is ok for them to give Fergus a treat. They have these to please people who bring their dogs. Good business.

[Gregg]

I can't imagine taking my dog to something other than a pet store. I don't know that I've seen anyone else do that yet. I don't think it would bug me super much in a Home Depot, but I also don't really see the point of it.

It is really fun to take Fergus to Bass Pro Shop when Santa is there for Christmas. Everyone in a good mood. Many want to pet the big doggy and get their pictures with him while waiting for their turn to talk to Santa. So many want to know about the bread.

He has been there 3 or 4 times. I do not believe I have taken him there outside of Christmas.

[Gregg]

Gregg's a nice guy but he often misses the nuance of the social contract. I point it out and I'm the bad guy--no worries, I own it.



If it bothers you that much--put me on ignore , don't engage in the thread or whatever it takes to make it tolerable for you.

First thanks to all for the spirited conversation.

I would like to address the three points above. Thank you for the kind words. I will disagree with you that I miss the nuance of social contract. Not agreeing with you/it is not the same as missing it.

I do not mind if someone wants to question my thinking. Even correct me, I might learn something. But lets not assume that I haven't given it much thought before we dig a little deeper.

Your last statement is a twin brother to my statement if you don't like dogs in dog friendly stores, put them on ignore er don't go to them.

[Gregg]

Who's to say what's inconsequential and what's not?

Obviously Dogs in store isn't a deal for Gregg, but is for me and my wife at the very least.

Who's sensibilities should be respected in these cases?

Now if Gregg had mentioned he's suffering from a case of Ken's angst and needs fluffy to help him keep his shit together in public, I'd defer to him.

If I mention dogs cause me to sneeze and he, as mentioned, just wants fluffy with him just because, he should defer to me.

That, from my perspective is the social contract.

Society is a participation sport, simply allowing what you believe are transgressions to go unaddressed because people might not want to hear it isn't going to help us evolve past the point we seem stuck in. A selfish, self absorbed, get mine no matter the cost way of life, which you must admit--is where we are at this moment in time for the most part.

I promise if you and your wife come to Chicago and want to join me for a cigar, I will not bring Fergus to the Dog Friendly Cigar shop (yes he has been there once).

[Gregg]

The couple with the St. Bernard's definitely sounds inconsiderate. But Gregg said he doesn't go down aisles with his dog when other people are in the aisles, and that he keeps his dog right next to him, that he goes the other way if someone comes toward him and appears uncomfortable with his dog. So I think he's trying to stay out the way. He said he allows extra time so that he can do this. It sounds to me like Gregg is trying to be considerate of the other shoppers to a fairly reasonable degree.

It seems like you had a legit issue with someone who wasn't controlling their dogs and decided to take that out on Gregg because he was pro-dogs-in-hardware-stores (but not in grocery stores). I wouldn't personally choose to do what Gregg does, but I don't see how he is inconveniencing anyone in any major way or being inconsiderate. I doubt Gregg would think that the St. Bernard couple handled things appropriately, although I guess he could speak for himself on that. Or you could have asked him.

So since you asked, saying this to him seems inconsiderate:

I do try to do these things.

I do not think the couple handled the St. Bernard's correctly. In fact many many people allow their dogs to behave in ways that give dog owners a bad name. I do not want to be that kind of owner.

[GwynnInTheHall]

Before I ever went into a store with my dog, I looked up dog friendly stores. There were much more than I ever imagined. Why would these retailers allow dogs in their stores? Because it is good for business.

We both like cigars. If a good restaurant opened near you that allowed cigar smoking would you go? I would. It would be fun and a treat. Would I try to smoke in a non smoking business, of course not. I would expect those that do not tolerate cigar smoke to stay away from the new cigar friendly restaurant. Not try to go there and complain they have allergies.

For me it is the same. Places that allow dogs, if I am in the mood I will take them up on that. I will also tell you that no one will have a problem with my dog's behavior or our manners. If these places change their minds I will not be bringing my dog. By the way, several of the dog friendly places ask me if it is ok for them to give Fergus a treat. They have these to please people who bring their dogs. Good business.

Gregg, if it were anyone else telling me this I'd call BS. BUT, I do believe you and though that may not be important, I do apologize for my assertions that you were being inconsiderate and entitled--if I was too harsh or hurt you in any way--I'm sorry--I was wrong. As noted, I should find which stores are dog friendly and avoid them--Which I will.

New question--Why just Dogs? Why not 'Pet' friendly? I know Dogs are the most popular, but they're not the smartest, cleanest or best behaved of all the pets--I say we strive for equality amongst our pets--bring a Ferret to the Bass Shop next time! It can ride Furgie's back!

As to the cigar question--No, I wouldn't go--I don't enjoy smoking nor smoke while I eat. My cigar time is at night, outside with a nice Bourbon or Tequila. However, when I moved in I did ask the neighbors if the smoke would bother them (we're in a quad cluster of cottages) as we're in pretty close proximity and the people behind us have 2 small children (one of the reasons why I smoke at night when they're not in the yard).

Thanks for the invite though I may never get back that way I've only been to Chicago once, in Winter--It was beautiful, but brutally cold. Now if you're ever in Tucson allow me to treat you to a cigar and a drink (if your so inclined). I promise it won't be cold.

Cheers.

[Gregg]

Gregg, if it were anyone else telling me this I'd call BS. BUT, I do believe you and though that may not be important, I do apologize for my assertions that you were being inconsiderate and entitled--if I was too harsh or hurt you in any way--I'm sorry--I was wrong. As noted, I should find which stores are dog friendly and avoid them--Which I will.

New question--Why just Dogs? Why not 'Pet' friendly? I know Dogs are the most popular, but they're not the smartest, cleanest or best behaved of all the pets--I say we strive for equality amongst our pets--bring a Ferret to the Bass Shop next time! It can ride Furgie's back!

As to the cigar question--No, I wouldn't go--I don't enjoy smoking nor smoke while I eat. My cigar time is at night, outside with a nice Bourbon or Tequila. However, when I moved in I did ask the neighbors if the smoke would bother them (we're in a quad cluster of cottages) as we're in pretty close proximity and the people behind us have 2 small children (one of the reasons why I smoke at night when they're not in the yard).

Thanks for the invite though I may never get back that way I've only been to Chicago once, in Winter--It was beautiful, but brutally cold. Now if you're ever in Tucson allow me to treat you to a cigar and a drink (if your so inclined). I promise it won't be cold.

Cheers.

Apology accepted.

I am surprised that you would not sit back and enjoy an after dinner beverage, good cigar and spirited conversation. Before the bands it was one of my favorite ways to enjoy a stogie. I do enjoy night time outside smokes preferably with a fire. If I get to Tucson I would enjoy meeting up.

Here is a partial list (38) of stores that allow dogs:

https://www.tidydogmom.com/index.php/2021/02/17/dog-friendly-stores/

At the least the list is interesting.

I can't see me ever take my dog with me when I buy clothes. Too stressful and it would take too long.

[Teenwolf]

Question for dog owners.

I showed up to work on a property today, and doing a walk around I see the owners have their dog locked in a shed, 300 ft from the house at 8 am. Presumably the dog is forced to sleep there. 9:30 am and dog is still locked up, no windows in shed. Food and water dishes outside the shed. This is awful. Here another couple hours, will watch if dog gets let out before then.

My inclination is to report the animal abuse immediately, but its a huge contract for my company. If the owners connect the reported abuse to me, I could be fired.

What would you do? Not being a dog owner, is there a reasonable excuse for this?

[heyelander]

Question for dog owners.

I showed up to work on a property today, and doing a walk around I see the owners have their dog locked in a shed, 300 ft from the house at 8 am. Presumably the dog is forced to sleep there. 9:30 am and dog is still locked up, no windows in shed. Food and water dishes outside the shed. This is awful. Here another couple hours, will watch if dog gets let out before then.

My inclination is to report the animal abuse immediately, but its a huge contract for my company. If the owners connect the reported abuse to me, I could be fired.

What would you do? Not being a dog owner, is there a reasonable excuse for this?

Is the dog locked away because you are there? maybe it has free roam when people aren't in the yard?

[Teenwolf]

Is the dog locked away because you are there? maybe it has free roam when people aren't in the yard?

That's a good point I hadn't considered. It's my first week back after weekly visits last year. Never encountered the dog anywhere before.

But they have a giant mansion, probably 5000 Sq ft. Is there no space to house the dog while I'm working other than the 10x10 ft shed away from the house? No windows, food or water, 2 hours and counting now, but probably more like 12 hours. Seems extremely unnecessary.

[overkill94]

Dang, this thread went all kinds of sideways.

My two cents: I friggin love dogs so I don't care where they are but I also don't understand why people bring their dogs to certain places. Some people are deathly afraid of dogs and no matter how well-behaved it is or how much the owner assures other people how tame they are, certain people will still be freaked out. Even if a store calls itself "pet-friendly", certain patrons won't even know that's the case and might be inconvenienced by having to avoid the situation or just deal with their own anxiety. If I happened to have a pet boa constrictor and wanted to take it to the grocery store do you think that would go over well?

[Gregg]

That's a good point I hadn't considered. It's my first week back after weekly visits last year. Never encountered the dog anywhere before.

But they have a giant mansion, probably 5000 Sq ft. Is there no space to house the dog while I'm working other than the 10x10 ft shed away from the house? No windows, food or water, 2 hours and counting now, but probably more like 12 hours. Seems extremely unnecessary.

12 hours without food or water is not good. I would report them and let the authorities ask the questions.

[madducks]

Dang, this thread went all kinds of sideways.

My two cents: I friggin love dogs so I don't care where they are but I also don't understand why people bring their dogs to certain places. Some people are deathly afraid of dogs and no matter how well-behaved it is or how much the owner assures other people how tame they are, certain people will still be freaked out. Even if a store calls itself "pet-friendly", certain patrons won't even know that's the case and might be inconvenienced by having to avoid the situation or just deal with their own anxiety. If I happened to have a pet boa constrictor and wanted to take it to the grocery store do you think that would go over well?

As long as it's a therapy boa constrictor, then it's ok.

[Ken]

12 hours without food or water is not good. I would report them and let the authorities ask the questions.

Without even talking to the owners?

Man, I'm glad people don't make incorrect assumptions when working on my property and just call the authorities based on assumptions.