Unconditional love?

[Gregg]

when my cat was dying of kidney and heart disease I worried she didn't understand I still loved her the same, while putting her through additional suffering trying to keep her alive longer. but she knew. she knew everything that was going on.

I guess ppl will say that's what pets do, give you unconditional love. but how do you handle that when your suffering or dying? I think there's a pattern. owners have it for pets. parents have it for their children. and gods have it for their creations. you can't measure it with science. you can't define it with philosophy. you can't compute it with logic. all you can do is experience it.

I think unconditional love is also what old ppl have for each other when one of them is dying. ppl debate end of life care. but it's not about an extra month to enjoy life. it's about an extra month to go back and try to fix the past.

in the two slit experiment when an electron goes thru either the left or the right, a decision is made. one that you can't reverse and change. if an observer is emotionally invested, being able to go back and change the results negates it's meaning.

but then im not sure there's ever been a time travel movie where love wasn't the reason. I wish you could measure love the way you measure time. both don't really seem to exist as a force of nature, only in it's minutiae.

A lot of good stuff in this post nully. Thanks for posting it.

[Gregg]

It may be that we just have a misunderstanding of terms. What do you consider to be your definition of hate?

Seems to me that your emotional reaction to stealing from the poor would fall under my definition of hate for the purposes of discussing hating the sin. If asked I would say that ElD hates stealing from the poor. Does he hate those people that steal from the poor? By your posts I would say probably not.

Oh and thanks for your help with my trade.

I was kind of hoping to hear a response to this. Not for the purposes of argument or ah ha, just greater understanding within the scope of this discussion.

[Pogues]

"Hatred (or hate) is a deep and emotional extreme dislike. It can be directed against individuals, entities, objects, or ideas. Hatred is often associated with feelings of anger, disgust and a disposition towards hostility."

There just aren't that many things that can rile me up to this level. I kind of always operate on the surface, immediately venting all my frustrations. I don't tend to harbor "deep and emotional extreme" dislikes because it's just not worth my time. I guess I "hate" serial rape or serial murder, as those were the sins that you were responding to, but it just strikes me as weird.

This phrase is most often used by Christians, in my experience, to reference homosexuality. Oddly, it's almost never referred to things that actually appear in the bible, like divorce or adultery.


I don't believe in sin, don't believe anyone is a "sinner", and object in the most extreme to people who use this kind of phrase to backhandedly refer to homosexuals or homosexual acts. As someone else noted, this phrase is typically used as some special sort of condescending "love" that Christians feel the need to dole out to homosexuals (most often) or those they feel superior to. The phrase implies some kind of authority, a moral high ground occupied by those proud of themselves and casting condemnation on those whose actions or predispositions offend our stilted morality. It strikes me as the exact opposite kind of thing that Jesus would say. In fact, when faced with an adulterous woman, someone who was "such a woman" to those condemning her, whose humanity was taken from her by those casting aspersions, Jesus did just the opposite: he said, "neither do I condemn you, go and sin no more." His was not a message of hate and, frankly, that kind of odious talk has no place coming from a place of love and tolerance without judgment. You're a sinner. Stop pointing the finger at what others do and fix yourself.

I like this...oh very much so.

[TranaGreg]

I like this...oh very much so.

do you love it? ...

[Pogues]

do you love it? ...

Maybe...but not unconditionally.

[Gregg]

"Hatred (or hate) is a deep and emotional extreme dislike. It can be directed against individuals, entities, objects, or ideas. Hatred is often associated with feelings of anger, disgust and a disposition towards hostility."

There just aren't that many things that can rile me up to this level. I kind of always operate on the surface, immediately venting all my frustrations. I don't tend to harbor "deep and emotional extreme" dislikes because it's just not worth my time. I guess I "hate" serial rape or serial murder, as those were the sins that you were responding to, but it just strikes me as weird.

This phrase is most often used by Christians, in my experience, to reference homosexuality. Oddly, it's almost never referred to things that actually appear in the bible, like divorce or adultery.


I don't believe in sin, don't believe anyone is a "sinner", and object in the most extreme to people who use this kind of phrase to backhandedly refer to homosexuals or homosexual acts. As someone else noted, this phrase is typically used as some special sort of condescending "love" that Christians feel the need to dole out to homosexuals (most often) or those they feel superior to. The phrase implies some kind of authority, a moral high ground occupied by those proud of themselves and casting condemnation on those whose actions or predispositions offend our stilted morality. It strikes me as the exact opposite kind of thing that Jesus would say. In fact, when faced with an adulterous woman, someone who was "such a woman" to those condemning her, whose humanity was taken from her by those casting aspersions, Jesus did just the opposite: he said, "neither do I condemn you, go and sin no more." His was not a message of hate and, frankly, that kind of odious talk has no place coming from a place of love and tolerance without judgment. You're a sinner. Stop pointing the finger at what others do and fix yourself.

Thank you.

This was well written and appreciate the response.

It may surprise you to know that I agree with much of what you have said.

Obviously I believe in sin. I also believe everyone is a sinner including Christians. That would be why we All need a Savior.

I am in agreement with you that many self proclaimed Christians handle the battle of sin in a way that would be offensive to God. The way to battle is love and service. It is not running around pointing out the sins of others. We are to try to be like Jesus. He did love all. He did not condone sin, but loved and sacrificed himself for all. My personal example is I am one who made alcohol and drugs my god. He delivered me from that. It is not my duty to battle addiction/sin by pointing out people who are in bondage or telling them to quit. It is to answer the call and help others who may want help in escaping this bondage. I am not more loved by God for doing this and I do not do this to earn God's love or salvation I do this out of love and gratitude to the One who delivered me. Someone did it for me. I have a love and sadness for those who are stuck in this. It is hard to get the feelings across in writing this. I can assure you that I do not have a holier than thou attitude in this arena. It is more of a good thing that I want to share with those who are in need. I have much to learn on this journey and no way do I think of myself as sinless. I do not want to cast stones.

[The Feral Slasher]

To put it mildly, something like this would be difficult. There must be more to the story, but I can't imagine what the parents must be going through. Just a sad situation, that would really test a parents unconditional love. Hopefully some day they can reconcile.

https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/dad-speaks-out-after-21-year-old-sues-him-to-pay-104864515872.html

[ironfist]

To put it mildly, something like this would be difficult. There must be more to the story, but I can't imagine what the parents must be going through. Just a sad situation, that would really test a parents unconditional love. Hopefully some day they can reconcile.

https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/dad-...864515872.html

I think I'd blame myself more for that one than the kid.

[Gregg]

To put it mildly, something like this would be difficult. There must be more to the story, but I can't imagine what the parents must be going through. Just a sad situation, that would really test a parents unconditional love. Hopefully some day they can reconcile.

https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/dad-...864515872.html

While it is a tough situation the dad never said he didn't love his daughter. In fact, he said he loves and misses her. The issue is that he is mad at the legal system for making him pay for an adult child's education.

I also believe there is much more to this whole story than we will ever know.