There is no proof that God exists

[B-Fly]

LOL...what a long strange trip this thread is starting to take.

[Fresno Bob]

Thank you for answering part of my question. What about the first part?

How long ago was it that we broke bread or in our case pizza?

10 years ago probably?

[Fresno Bob]

My ultra-religious (Catholic) friend's father actually once made this argument to me as to why I should believe. Just in case, why wouldn't I want to be on His good side. He's also an ER Dr.

My friend, who was rebellious like me in our youth, is about to have his 9th child and somehow became even more fanatical than his parents.

It's called Pascal's Wager

“Belief is a wise wager. Granted that faith cannot be proved, what harm will come to you if you gamble on its truth and it proves false? If you gain, you gain all; if you lose, you lose nothing. Wager, then, without hesitation, that He exists.”

[Fresno Bob]

Here's a question for all of you: Was there an "aha!" moment for you in arriving at your current level of belief or disbelief in G-d? Or was your current level of belief/disbelief something that either always existed or settled in so gradually that you can't really pinpoint when or why you arrived where you are?

For me, I have no recollection of ever believing in G-d, despite that I was brought to synagogue services and sent to Hebrew School as a child. (My parents kept kosher in the house and being Jewish was always (and remains) integral to my identity, but I don't recall my parents specifically ever telling me what they believed to be "true" about the religion. By the time I have memory of speaking with them about their own beliefs before I already self-identified as atheist. (My Dad doesn't know but thinks it doesn't really matter whether you believe in G-d or Truth or not - you honor and draw community and comfort from the traditions; my Mom believes in G-d but not necessarily in the Truth of scripture, and puts far less stock in ritual observances).

mine was in 4th grade when I did my first serious reading of evolution and mythology.

[Gregg]

I'm just trying to react to postings/questions. We are on page 4, and no one has yet offered any proof of the existence of God.

I just have 2 simple questions? Do you believe that God exists? If yes, prove it.

What proof would you accept?

[Steve 2.0]

What proof would you accept?

I guess more importantly, what would you?

[Gregg]

I guess more importantly, what would you?

Please read this in the calm and respectful tone that I am writing it.

I am not sure why you stated your comment/question this way?

I am not the one that said "prove it." I asked the question to understand what is acceptable proof.

Is there any proof that is acceptable?

I do plan on posting something later that is a big deal to my belief and proof to me. Unfortunately I have a business conference call in few minutes.

[Steve 2.0]

Please read this in the calm and respectful tone that I am writing it.

I am not sure why you stated your comment/question this way?

I am not the one that said "prove it." I asked the question to understand what is acceptable proof.

Is there any proof that is acceptable?

I do plan on posting something later that is a big deal to my belief and proof to me. Unfortunately I have a business conference call in few minutes.

Sorry, No disrespect intended.

I just wondered what proof you accepted. To me (and this is just me) without God directly talking to me, there is no proof of God. There is only faith in God. (Just the way I see it).

[Steve 2.0]

I'll go back to the Sports Bar, where I belong!

[Gregg]

Sorry, No disrespect intended.

I just wondered what proof you accepted. To me (and this is just me) without God directly talking to me, there is no proof of God. There is only faith in God. (Just the way I see it).

No problem and a good question.

There are issues with God talking to you as proof. First it would only be proof for you. Jesus was clear in wanting his followers to spread the word (good news). If I told you God talked to me you would most likely not believe me.

Another issue is that if God talked to you one time with words or thoughts, how would you know it was not you talking to yourself. Also as time goes by that one singular event starts to fade. If there are not others we will start to doubt what originally happened. Although for some this may be a step off point from proof to faith.

[Gregg]

I'll go back to the Sports Bar, where I belong!

I think you belong in this one if you want to. This has been a very civil discussion.

We actually agree on some of issues that cause anger and mistrust of Christians.

[Steve 2.0]

No problem and a good question.

There are issues with God talking to you as proof. First it would only be proof for you. Jesus was clear in wanting his followers to spread the word (good news). If I told you God talked to me you would most likely not believe me.

Another issue is that if God talked to you one time with words or thoughts, how would you know it was not you talking to yourself. Also as time goes by that one singular event starts to fade. If there are not others we will start to doubt what originally happened. Although for some this may be a step off point from proof to faith.

Yep. If you told me God talked to you, I would not believe you (or any of my friends/family for that matter.) or for that matter a priest/preacher. Just not buying it. Never been a big believer in "God told me to tell you.....". Uh, yeah....

The issue of my sanity if I thought God talked to me is another good point.

I also get tired of people pointing at rainbows, babies, or any other cute thing and say that is proof of God. It's not. And if you believe it is, you have to believe that every storm, starving baby, or any ugly thing is proof that God does not exist.

I would NEVER make fun of someone for their religion, they are free to believe whatever they want, but trying to prove God's existence is a futile battle. IF I was a believer, I would simply say, no, I can not prove God's existence, I just have faith that he exists. That's the only way it makes sense.

[Gregg]

Yep. If you told me God talked to you, I would not believe you (or any of my friends/family for that matter.) or for that matter a priest/preacher. Just not buying it. Never been a big believer in "God told me to tell you.....". Uh, yeah....

The issue of my sanity if I thought God talked to me is another good point.

I also get tired of people pointing at rainbows, babies, or any other cute thing and say that is proof of God. It's not. And if you believe it is, you have to believe that every storm, starving baby, or any ugly thing is proof that God does not exist.

I would NEVER make fun of someone for their religion, they are free to believe whatever they want, but trying to prove God's existence is a futile battle. IF I was a believer, I would simply say, no, I can not prove God's existence, I just have faith that he exists. That's the only way it makes sense.

Me either. I run the other way if a Christian tells me God told me to tell you.

That is much different than Jesus telling us to spread the good news.

Regarding this: IF I was a believer, I would simply say, no, I can not prove God's existence, I just have faith that he exists.

So what would it take for you to have faith God exists?

[Steve 2.0]

I also acknowledge that religion has served positive ends for the human species as well as negative ones. It's not all about controlling people or subjugating women or justifying in-group supremacy, etc.

But it is MOSTLY about controlling people and subjugating women.

[Steve 2.0]

Me either. I run the other way if a Christian tells me God told me to tell you.

That is much different than Jesus telling us to spread the good news.

Regarding this: IF I was a believer, I would simply say, no, I can not prove God's existence, I just have faith that he exists.

So what would it take for you to have faith God exists?

That is an excellent question and I'm not sure I have the answer. BUT if God exists and he want me to believe in him, HE should know how to convince me, right?