President Donald Trump

[Hornsby]

We’re you not around for the previous 8 years. Or was it your guy doing the partisan shit that you failed to catch how the other side perceived it? Truly, all kidding aside (sort of) I get your what you’re saying. There was a sense of decorum. And, Trump has brought us all down to a new low bar, but the previous 8 years and 16 and 24 helped lead to this.

Everyone seems to have a selective memory regarding their preferred party, my recollection was that Obama tried for 6 years to work together to get things passed. Granted, they were HIS pet projects, but the GOP was totally obstructionist during that time. They took it to new levels. Politics are always partisan in this country...the 2 party system is flawed in that respect. I sometimes wonder if a system where they have several parties and need to work together to form a functioning government might not work better here. But that ship has sailed.

And the previous 228 years have contributed to where we are today...it's nothing new, IMO. But Trump is.

[revo]

Can speak for bg, but in one sense, Trump has been one of the best at keeping his campaign promises...they suck, but he's committed to them, hence his base being so fervently supportive still.

I get this, but is it really “keeping campaign promises” when you’re half-assing them at every turn? When you come up with policy while sitting on the toilet watching Fox & Friends? When many of his new “policies” get walked back within days?

That’s the part I don’t get. I can’t, for the life of me, understand how his base doesn’t see how he’s totally winging it, trying to push through campaign promises without doing any homework.

EDIT — I see you feel the same, in another post.

[revo]

So while the new tax bill lowers the tax rate for corporations, it also chops deductions for many routine business expenses like entertainment and meals. It also whacks personal deductions for commuting, if a company covered them. Obviously this may have an impact on many industries in larger cities, but good thing the GOP thinks all major cities are “liberal!”

[Bernie Brewer]

Everyone seems to have a selective memory regarding their preferred party, my recollection was that Obama tried for 6 years to work together to get things passed. Granted, they were HIS pet projects, but the GOP was totally obstructionist during that time. They took it to new levels. Politics are always partisan in this country...the 2 party system is flawed in that respect. I sometimes wonder if a system where they have several parties and need to work together to form a functioning government might not work better here. But that ship has sailed.

And the previous 228 years have contributed to where we are today...it's nothing new, IMO. But Trump is.

I agree with the bolder. But, why has that sailed? I’m kind of hope out of this cratering of the GOP and the disruption I the DNC a new party of more moderate/centrist voices. I may be a dreamer, but I’m not the only, I hope someday you’ll join us, and we can live as one. John Lennon should have Conferred with me

[cardboardbox]

I agree with the bolder. But, why has that sailed? I’m kind of hope out of this cratering of the GOP and the disruption I the DNC a new party of more moderate/centrist voices. I may be a dreamer, but I’m not the only, I hope someday you’ll join us, and we can live as one.

because the electoral college is winner take all in most states. If all or nearly all states changed to proportional EC votes, I think we would start to see real 3rd parties emerge.

The primary process pushes candidates/parties to the fringes, not sure if we will see moderation any time soon.

[cardboardbox]

I agree with this post (that’s a thing now, right? To agree with posts?)

[Bernie Brewer]

because the electoral college is winner take all in most states. If all or nearly all states changed to proportional EC votes, I think we would start to see real 3rd parties emerge.

The primary process pushes candidates/parties to the fringes, not sure if we will see moderation any time soon.

I know. It would require lots of change and cooperation and strong leadership with the ability to put thier partisan politics aside for the best interests of the country. Particularly, it would require which ever party just benefited from the most recent EC vote to see the bigger picture!

But based on the bipartisan support of the tax bill yesterday, change should be easy.

I just saw that non partisan Nancy Pelosi, who would never be hyperbolic, referred to the Tax bill as “the worst bill ever to come to the floor” for a vote. And, while I have no significant issues with this bill, your mileage may vary (as Chance would say) I would guess that reasonable people might find The Fugitive Slave Act of 1850 as probably slightly worse than this tax bill. Or, maybe the The Indian Removal Act of 1830? ( Insert many others here. ). Thanks Nancy, for showing everyone how it’s done. That’s leadership!!!

[baldgriff]

Its kind of funny that you ask me to give it a break when my comment was essentially an agreement with DMT about the process the Dems used.

Feral Slasher stated:
I don't think the last election had anything to do with who had a better plan for governing and accomplishing stated goals. That was very low on the list. I think that was the case for both sides

DMT then said:
"Maybe in the general, but if that was the case for the Dem primaries, Bernie would've won IMO."

To which I agreed by making my statement you have quoted. I am essentially agreeing with DMT that Bernie may have been able to win the nomination. RF - I didnt bring up the fact that Bernie may have gotten screwed - I elaborated on the statement originally made by someone on the left side - who apparently also thinks that If the Dems actually had a plan for selecting a candidate best to govern or accomplishing stated goals in the primaries then Bernis would've won.

The Dems had a HUGE opportunity to run away with the Presidency, but because they were so #Imwithher they lost. All those millenials that would have carried Bernie to the win wouldnt vote for her - because she didnt represent them.

I didnt vote for either Trump or HRC - and I can at least go to bed knowing I made no deal with the devil or voted against my principals.

[gcstomp]

pelosi referring to it as worst bill in her lifetime, I would think, and not of all events in planetary existence, and while she is ancient, she was not firsthand involved with bills from 1850. U.S. is a strange bird, in that most people think there is some rough correlation between hard work and wealth. I have no doubt there are well to do people who put in long hours, as well as understanding that the typical household cobbling together multiple part time jobs and working 80 hour weeks to hold family together while living in poverty have a different level of pain that cannot be fathomed by people who mouth those same words of "hard work".

Top .1% (1/10th of 1 percent) of households now hold about the same amount of wealth as the bottom 90%. http://www.businessinsider.com/ameri...tom-90-2017-10
2 party system, one party actively fights against its own self interest as evident in this bill, where wealth of that sliver will continue to vacuum everything, while 90%+ claw for air to make it to next payday.

[revo]

I know. It would require lots of change and cooperation and strong leadership with the ability to put thier partisan politics aside for the best interests of the country. Particularly, it would require which ever party just benefited from the most recent EC vote to see the bigger picture!

But based on the bipartisan support of the tax bill yesterday, change should be easy.

I just saw that non partisan Nancy Pelosi, who would never be hyperbolic, referred to the Tax bill as “the worst bill ever to come to the floor” for a vote. And, while I have no significant issues with this bill, your mileage may vary (as Chance would say) I would guess that reasonable people might find The Fugitive Slave Act of 1850 as probably slightly worse than this tax bill. Or, maybe the The Indian Removal Act of 1830? ( Insert many others here. ). Thanks Nancy, for showing everyone how it’s done. That’s leadership!!!

Speaking of Chancellor, any idea where he is? he literally just went off the grid one day in August.

[Redbirds Fan]

Its kind of funny that you ask me to give it a break when my comment was essentially an agreement with DMT about the process the Dems used.

Feral Slasher stated:
I don't think the last election had anything to do with who had a better plan for governing and accomplishing stated goals. That was very low on the list. I think that was the case for both sides

DMT then said:
"Maybe in the general, but if that was the case for the Dem primaries, Bernie would've won IMO."

To which I agreed by making my statement you have quoted. I am essentially agreeing with DMT that Bernie may have been able to win the nomination. RF - I didnt bring up the fact that Bernie may have gotten screwed - I elaborated on the statement originally made by someone on the left side - who apparently also thinks that If the Dems actually had a plan for selecting a candidate best to govern or accomplishing stated goals in the primaries then Bernis would've won.

The Dems had a HUGE opportunity to run away with the Presidency, but because they were so #Imwithher they lost. All those millenials that would have carried Bernie to the win wouldnt vote for her - because she didnt represent them.

I didnt vote for either Trump or HRC - and I can at least go to bed knowing I made no deal with the devil or voted against my principals.

"All those millenials" who couldn't even win the open primaries for him were suddenly going to win the general for him?

And you think an actual socialist with a sketchy history and a scam artist wife was going to survive the GOP attack dogs once they turned their attention from Hillary and started going after him? Don't be so naive.

And you can go to bed knowing that it was the bottom of the ninth with the game on the line...the ball was hit right to you...and you let it go right between your legs.

[Hornsby]

I know. It would require lots of change and cooperation and strong leadership with the ability to put thier partisan politics aside for the best interests of the country. Particularly, it would require which ever party just benefited from the most recent EC vote to see the bigger picture!

But based on the bipartisan support of the tax bill yesterday, change should be easy.

I just saw that non partisan Nancy Pelosi, who would never be hyperbolic, referred to the Tax bill as “the worst bill ever to come to the floor” for a vote. And, while I have no significant issues with this bill, your mileage may vary (as Chance would say) I would guess that reasonable people might find The Fugitive Slave Act of 1850 as probably slightly worse than this tax bill. Or, maybe the The Indian Removal Act of 1830? ( Insert many others here. ). Thanks Nancy, for showing everyone how it’s done. That’s leadership!!!

I'm curious, do you really think that adding 1.5 Trillion to the deficit is going to be OK? I won't even classify as good, since that simply not an option IMO. How about future cutting of Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security? Because the vast majority of economists that I've seen quoted seem to think that's going to be inevitable to support this bill?

Yes, in the short term most people will get a tax cut...but in the long term....hoo boy. It reminds me of an old boss I once had, if you showed him a plan that would give him a dime profit right away, and then one that would give him a dollar, he'd jump at the dime right away. No thought to the long term effects...

You're a smart guy, and you know money...convince me why my opinion is wrong.

[Redbirds Fan]

I'm curious, do you really think that adding 1.5 Trillion to the deficit is going to be OK? I won't even classify as good, since that simply not an option IMO. How about future cutting of Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security? Because the vast majority of economists that I've seen quoted seem to think that's going to be inevitable to support this bill?

Yes, in the short term most people will get a tax cut...but in the long term....hoo boy. It reminds me of an old boss I once had, if you showed him a plan that would give him a dime profit right away, and then one that would give him a dollar, he'd jump at the dime right away. No thought to the long term effects...

You're a smart guy, and you know money...convince me why my opinion is wrong.

Paul Ryan has already fessed up what we all know...that Congress will be back to 'reform' Medicare, Medicaid and SS. As for increasing the deficit, this student of Ayn Rand says there is "no way to tell" what will happen in the future. (eye roll)

[nots]

"All those millenials" who couldn't even win the open primaries for him were suddenly going to win the general for him?

And you think an actual socialist with a sketchy history and a scam artist wife was going to survive the GOP attack dogs once they turned their attention from Hillary and started going after him? Don't be so naive.

And you can go to bed knowing that it was the bottom of the ninth with the game on the line...the ball was hit right to you...and you let it go right between your legs.

I don’t know about all those millennials, but I think enough pro-union , anti-NAFTA folks in Michigan, Wisconsin, Iowa and Pennsylvania would have voted for him over the TPP candidate and swung those states away from Trump. i guess we’ll never know for sure, but we can be sure that she was given every opportunity to win (and he wasn’t by the DNC) and she choked on it.

[baldgriff]

And you can go to bed knowing that it was the bottom of the ninth with the game on the line...the ball was hit right to you...and you let it go right between your legs.

BULLSHIT! Plain and simple. More complaining about how someone that doesnt agree with the left's line of thinking should have made the decision to be #imwithher in order to stop #makeamericagreatagain. Neither party represent me - why would I cast my vote for either of them.

No Sir - I didnt drop the ball here. I didnt even play your game.