President Donald Trump

[chancellor]

A couple of months ago I saw a car with two bumper stickers. One was a 'Trump '20' sticker, the other said 'Vietnam Veteran.' The irony is amazing. If this was 50 years ago, I'm sure this same guy would have put a bullet in the draft dodging Trump's back, but now not only does he vote for him, he avidly supports him. The right amazes me with their pretzel logic.

Then, logically, no Vietnam Vet should vote for either candidate since they both deferred and medicalled their way out of the war, right?

[Sour Masher]

Then, logically, no Vietnam Vet should vote for either candidate since they both deferred and medicalled their way out of the war, right?

What do you think of the story KS posted? Do you think it is a fake smear piece? Or do you think it may be true? If the latter, does it change your perception of Trump at all? Do you see a difference between the two if one says and thinks things like this?

[GwynnInTheHall]

Then, logically, no Vietnam Vet should vote for either candidate since they both deferred and medicalled their way out of the war, right?

I'd vote for the one who doesn't have a record of calling POWs losers, disparaging dead vets and rewarding war criminals...but that's just me. (USAF)

[Sour Masher]

I'd vote for the one who doesn't have a record of calling POWs losers, disparaging dead vets and rewarding war criminals...but that's just me. (USAF)

It amazes me that he never pays the price for such comments, especially on the right. Before Trump I thought reverence for service was higher on the right than the left, but Trump has proven that false. If Obama said about McCain what Trump said about him or called those serving in the military suckers and all the other stuff Trump has said, talking heads would have exploded, and Fox News would have had to hire a full time lens wiper to constantly wipe away the righteous indignation fury spittle continually bursting forth from every pundit on the network. Tears would have been fought back as they denounced him in the most patriotic terms. Yet these things are continually ignored, denied, and justified by Trump supporters.

ETA: Oh, and in case it comes up--yep, I think Pelosi 100% deserves flak for getting caught thinking she was better than others (same as Chris Christie when he used a closed beach, and dismissed complaints with, and I am only slightly paraphrasing, "I'm the governor, I'm better than you, suck it!").

[GwynnInTheHall]

It amazes me that he never pays the price for such comments, especially on the right. Before Trump I thought reverence for service was higher on the right than the left, but Trump has proven that false. If Obama said about McCain what Trump said about him or called those serving in the military suckers and all the other stuff Trump has said, talking heads would have exploded, and Fox News would have had to hire a full time lens wiper to constantly wipe away the righteous indignation fury spittle continually bursting forth from every pundit on the network. Tears would have been fought back as they denounced him in the most patriotic terms. Yet these things are continually ignored, denied, and justified by Trump supporters.

ETA: Oh, and in case it comes up--yep, I think Pelosi 100% deserves flak for getting caught thinking she was better than others (same as Chris Christie when he used a closed beach, and dismissed complaints with, and I am only slightly paraphrasing, "I'm the governor, I'm better than you, suck it!").

Those on the left have always held themselves to a higher standard than those on the right, not all but in majority--it's been pretty clear (Trump making it abundantly more so) that they are willing to compromise their morals/values to get something they want.

[DMT]

Those on the left have always held themselves to a higher standard than those on the right, not all but in majority--it's been pretty clear (Trump making it abundantly more so) that they are willing to compromise their morals/values to get something they want.

Their only "principles" are power and money.

[Sour Masher]

Their only "principles" are power and money.

I think you are talking about the people at the top, the ones in office. Honestly, at the top, extremes like Trump aside, are they all really THAT different? Some, maybe. Most, I don't know--your sentence seems to apply, to varying degrees, to most of them, right and left alike. Trump is like a funhouse mirror version of the average politician, but underneath the distortions and extremes, the inartfulness in hiding these truths, many of them share these first principles, though many justify their quest to gain and maintain power with good deeds.

I am more perplexed by the bases--the dyed and the wool folks. Trump has really made me reevaluate what down home, main street not wall street, regular ol' republicans really, truly stand for. I thought among their first principles were respect for the law (Trump, after all touts himself as a law and order candidate), yet they allow him to break the law without rebuke. He calls for laws to be broken all of the time, and it is ignored or dismissed as humor. His worldview does not account for self-sacrifice for a greater good, a fact he has proven time and again, so the reports of his comments about military service are not at all surprising to anyone except those, to quote Jeremiah, "who have eyes, but see not, who have ears, but hear not." He puts himself first in all things. He is a boisterous, bombastic, bully and braggart who never worked a hard day in his life, who inherited his daddy's fortune and through hook and crook, ended up with less than if he'd put it all in an S and P 500 mutual fund. He spits on the constitution constantly.

I thought for a long time that he has bamboozled most people on the right. But I've come to realize that isn't it for far more people than I wanted to accept at first. Sadly, for many that support him, it isn't that he has tricked them into thinking he is for good things like self-service, humility, kindness, compassion and other Christian virtues so often touted on the right. It isn't that they think him these things at all. The very sad reality is that many love him exactly for who he is, who we know him to be. They stare into the abyss of this man's eyes longingly, embracing the hatred staring back at them as their own.

[chancellor]

I'd vote for the one who doesn't have a record of calling POWs losers, disparaging dead vets and rewarding war criminals...but that's just me. (USAF)

Now, that's different. Revo's post clearly said it was hypocritical for a Vietnam Vet to vote for Trump because he's a draft dodger. But Biden used exactly the same means Trump did (deferments, questionable medical exclusion) to avoid Vietnam, too.

[Sour Masher]

Now, that's different. Revo's post clearly said it was hypocritical for a Vietnam Vet to vote for Trump because he's a draft dodger. But Biden used exactly the same means Trump did (deferments, questionable medical exclusion) to avoid Vietnam, too.

His son Beau served, and got a Bronze Star for his service, which is more than any Trump has done. If we are going to try to pin his son Hunter's sin of leveraging the family name on him, might as well give him a little credit for supporting his other son's service. Trump would have dissuaded his sons by calling them suckers and losers if they wanted to serve.

[revo]

Now, that's different. Revo's post clearly said it was hypocritical for a Vietnam Vet to vote for Trump because he's a draft dodger. But Biden used exactly the same means Trump did (deferments, questionable medical exclusion) to avoid Vietnam, too.

Biden is 4 years older, was married and more importantly, was already in law school by the time Vietnam War draft inductions surged in 1966. Being in law school allowed him to be deferred until he graduated in 1968, and being married (although that deferment ended in late 1965) and towards the end of the 18-26 draft age spectrum, he was already far down the draft list and isn't exactly in the same boat as Trump, who had none of those things and truly was a prime candidate to be drafted.

Still, with his diagnosis of "asthma" I suppose you could make a case for it.

[Gregg]

Their only "principles" are power and money.

I am thinking being President is not nearly as much fun as it once was.

[Steve 2.0]

I am thinking being President is not nearly as much fun as it once was.

Do you mean in general or are you referring to the current Idiot that holds the office?

[Gregg]

Do you mean in general or are you referring to the current Idiot that holds the office?

In general.

[chancellor]

Biden is 4 years older, was married and more importantly, was already in law school by the time Vietnam War draft inductions surged in 1966. Being in law school allowed him to be deferred until he graduated in 1968, and being married (although that deferment ended in late 1965) and towards the end of the 18-26 draft age spectrum, he was already far down the draft list and isn't exactly in the same boat as Trump, who had none of those things and truly was a prime candidate to be drafted.

Still, with his diagnosis of "asthma" I suppose you could make a case for it.

Odds favoring Trump or no, Biden covered his bases exactly the same way - multiple deferments and a mystery health condition once they could no longer defer.

[revo]

Continuing his disdain for all forms of journalism, Trump shuts down the official military newspaper Stars & Stripes effective 9/15. Stars & Stripes has been in continuous publication since 1861.
#thanksdonald