Pay to Play Draft Discussion Thread

[Erik]

1. Once again, Traut stole my pick. Oh well, I have Rudolph in several other leagues.

2. Damn Frae, that's a ridiculous amount of analysis. I'll read it after I shake the cobwebs off.

[frae]

Here's my thinking....

In years past, there have nearly always been adequate WR fill ins on the waiver wire. I wanted two great WRs and I got them (Fitz and DeSean). I really like DeSean this year, especially after reading this --- http://sports.espn.go.com/fantasy/fo...page=TMR120824 . Mike Vick himself says to target DeSean (not Maclin) in drafts. Doesn't get much better than that in terms of an endorsement. There are at least a dozen WRs that will be on the wire to start the year that are pick up-able. Why would "lack of depth at WR" be a concern? Backups don't get you fantasy points. If one of my WRs gets injured I have a replacement. If both get injured, well I'm probably in some trouble, but will just fish on the WW. Planning to have two great backups accruing zero points week after week seems like poor strategy to me.

My thoughts are that at least one, if not more, of my RBs will emerge from the quagmire to be a full timer. This strategy has worked for me over and over again. Right now I think my next star in the making is Kevin Smith, personally. Either way, Smith or Turner or Beanie or, hell, just about any of those guys are worthy of a flex play behind Jackson and Murray.

Why would I need a backup QB on my roster right now? Eli is the most consistent QB in the NFL in terms of injuries. I'll pick up some guy or other for the one week in which I'll need him, but backup QBs put up zero points all year long...

Eventually I'll get some TE that sucks just as much as the rest of you guys'.


My season will ride on how well Jackson and Murray perform, imo. I'm not sure I know the answer to that and I don't love having my season hinge on those two but I'm not sure how else I could have structured my team to offset that risk.

My thoughts on WR depth is we are PPR and having only 3 means you can't use them at flex, unless you are putting Titus in there. Your starting roster is certainly covered, but to me depth at WR gives you options. If you think I didn't like DeSean, you should read Gris...."DeSean is one half of the IJD (Inconsistent Jackson Duo). He and Vincent will destroy Fantasy teams every year with their inconsistency. DeSean hasn’t been consistent since his 2009 season when he did actually end the season ranked ninth in consistency. However, since then he’s ranked 30th and 29th respectively at or barely over 50 percent QSR each season. I will confess right here that neither of the Jacksons will be on my Fantasy teams in 2012 and they should not be on yours either!"

Anyway, you do have enough RB's and upside backup RB's that if they pan out you won't need to use a WR at flex and all will be fine.

[frae]

I guess we're just not going to agree. You're praising guys like Crabtree and putting down DeSean --- I know pretty well where I stand on that issue. DeSean is a great WR2 to have, imo.


Can you explain to me what you mean by "depth at WR gives you options"? Options about who to start each week? I will be starting Fitzgerald and DeSean every single week they're healthy, bar none, despite the fact that Gris doesn't like DeSean.

I mean at flex your only options are RB and in PPR some RB's aren't always great plays there. When it is PPR, it is easier for a WR to score points than some RBBC backs.

As for praising Crabtree vs DeSean. That is a draft positon thing with Crabtree. Crabtree went in rd 12. That isn't going to make or break anyones draft if he doesn't pan out. If DJ isn't solid for you it puts a big hole on your team as the only other option you have is Titus Young who has upside too and I like, but not exactly a proven option yet.

[frae]

The only potential RBBC guy I have is Morris who will only touch my starting lineup if either he breaks out for several weeks and establishes himself as the unquestionable starter or if every single other guy gets hurt.


I stopped counting after 20 starting Wide Receivers currently on the waiver wire. Starting running back on the WW? Zero.

Well I think we aren't going to agree on this one, but one last questions. I assume you are counting Toby as just behind AP. How is Smith and Wells not in RBBC? Smith will certainly share carries with LeShoure if both are healthy. Same with Beanie and Ryan Williams. I mean I would say Beanie goes 65/35 but Williams has earned a role.

Anyway, we will see as your other post said health is about as big of a factor as anything. Gotta hit the road now, driving home from Ohio.

[Erik]

Andy Reid Diet Plan - Drew Brees is a great place to start a team and Wes Welker has been PPR gold over the years. Welker has been a great WR 1 in PPR for years and hopefully he has another big year in store for Erik. Maclin looked on the way to stardom not long ago so if the injuries are behind him he may also be a nice pick. The concern for this team is at RB. McGahee is 30 with almost 1800 carries and has never been a pass catching guy. He needs to stay healthy and take at least 200 carries for this team. Ryan Williams has flashed a lot of talent, but he is probably on the wrong side of the time share while Beanie is healthy. Kendall Hunter is not really a flex play while Gore is healthy. I do like the Jacquizzi Rodgers pick and I think he will earn more and more of a role. Moore and Crabtree are fine WR bench options and Crabtree especially could put it back together and be a good WR3. Fred Davis was very good when he wasn't smoking weed, so he could be a solid TE1. No backup QB yet. I like the WR's and of course Brees. If some of these RB's get lead roles or at least on the better side of the time share they could compete.

Because of how things shook out, I built my team around QB and WR and invested in lottery tickets for RB. I think there's a good chance that one or both of Turner and Gore run out of gas this year, and I never trust Beanie Wells to stay healthy, so my season depends on one or more of Rodgers, Hunter or R. Williams getting the top job. They are my best bets for keepers next year also. Obviously I like Fred Davis if he can stay off the weed. I think he can become a top 5 TE this year. As for McGahee, Jon Fox loves to run the ball, and he loves veterans.

This is a much more charitable assessment than I was expecting, since most teams are much better set at RB than I am.

[Erik]

As for Vincent Jackson, he's in a different offense with a different QB, therefore I didn't put much stock in his consistency numbers from past years.

[Erik]

Rd 1 1 Bad News Kennels - ARIAN FOSTER, RB
Rd 1 2 He Hate Me - RAY RICE, RB
Rd 1 3 Hornsby - CALVIN JOHNSON, WR
Rd 1 4 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - MATT FORTE, RB
Rd 1 5 G-G-G-G-Men - CHRIS JOHNSON, RB
Rd 1 6 Bad News Kennels - RYAN MATHEWS, RB
Rd 1 7 Schlesinj - DOUG MARTIN, RB
Rd 1 8 Andy Reid Diet Plan - WES WELKER, WR
Rd 1 9 Diablowupdoll - LARRY FITZGERALD, WR
Rd 1 10 Iron City Lights - STEVEN JACKSON, RB
Rd 1 11 Phreak's Playas - LeSEAN McCOY, RB
Rd 1 12 Griswolds - TOM BRADY, QB
Rd 2 1 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - ADRIAN PETERSON, RB
Rd 2 2 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - ANDRE JOHNSON, WR
Rd 2 3 Iron City Lights - TRENT RICHARDSON, RB
Rd 2 4 Diablowupdoll - FRED JACKSON, RB
Rd 2 5 Andy Reid Diet Plan - DREW BREES, QB
Rd 2 6 Schlesinj - BRANDON MARSHALL, WR
Rd 2 7 Bad News Kennels - GREG JENNINGS, WR
Rd 2 8 G-G-G-G-Men - RODDY WHITE, WR
Rd 2 9 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - MAURICE JONES-DREW, RB
Rd 2 10 Hornsby - REGGIE BUSH, RB
Rd 2 11 He Hate Me - AHMAD BRADSHAW, RB
Rd 2 12 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - MATT RYAN, QB
Rd 3 1 Piney Boy - MARQUES COLSTON, WR
Rd 3 2 He Hate Me - PERCY HARVIN, WR
Rd 3 3 Phreak's Playas - MIKE WALLACE, WR
Rd 3 4 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - DEZ BRYANT, WR
Rd 3 5 G-G-G-G-Men - FRANK GORE, RB
Rd 3 6 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - DWAYNE BOWE, WR
Rd 3 7 Schlesinj - BENJARVUS GREEN-ELLIS, RB
Rd 3 8 Andy Reid Diet Plan - JEREMY MACLIN, WR
Rd 3 9 He Hate Me - ANTONIO GATES, TE
Rd 3 10 Iron City Lights - AARON RODGERS, QB
Rd 3 11 Phreak's Playas - MATT STAFFORD, QB
Rd 3 12 Griswolds - TORREY SMITH, WR
Rd 4 1 Griswolds - STEVE SMITH (CAR), WR
Rd 4 2 Phreak's Playas - JERMICHAEL FINLEY, TE
Rd 4 3 Iron City Lights - ERIC DECKER, WR
Rd 4 4 Diablowupdoll - MICHAEL TURNER, RB
Rd 4 5 Andy Reid Diet Plan - VINCENT JACKSON, WR
Rd 4 6 Schlesinj - AJ GREEN, WR
Rd 4 7 Bad News Kennels - MILES AUSTIN, WR
Rd 4 8 G-G-G-G-Men - JAMAL CHARLES, RB
Rd 4 9 Bad News Kennels - JASON WITTEN, TE
Rd 4 10 Hornsby - PEYTON HILLIS, RB
Rd 4 11 He Hate Me - JULIO JONES, WR
Rd 4 12 Piney Boy - TONY ROMO, QB
Rd 5 1 Piney Boy - STEVAN RIDLEY, RB
Rd 5 2 He Hate Me - PIERRE GARCON, WR
Rd 5 3 Hornsby - JIMMY GRAHAM, TE
Rd 5 4 Iron City Lights - VERNON DAVIS, TE
Rd 5 5 G-G-G-G-Men - PHILIP RIVERS, QB
Rd 5 6 Bad News Kennels - DARREN McFADDEN, RB
Rd 5 7 Schlesinj - ROBERT GRIFFIN III, QB
Rd 5 8 Andy Reid Diet Plan - JACQUIZZ RODGERS, RB
Rd 5 9 Diablowupdoll - KEVIN SMITH, RB
Rd 5 10 He Hate Me - SAN FRANCISCO, D/ST
Rd 5 11 Phreak's Playas - CJ SPILLER, RB
Rd 5 12 Griswolds - DEANGELO WILLIAMS, RB
Rd 6 1 Griswolds - REGGIE WAYNE, WR
Rd 6 2 Hornsby - DAVID WILSON, RB
Rd 6 3 Iron City Lights - STEVIE JOHNSON, WR
Rd 6 4 Diablowupdoll - DESEAN JACKSON, WR
Rd 6 5 Andy Reid Diet Plan - WILLIS MCGAHEE, RB
Rd 6 6 Schlesinj - ROB GRONKOWSKI, TE
Rd 6 7 Bad News Kennels - MICHAEL VICK, QB
Rd 6 8 Phreak's Playas - MARK INGRAM, RB
Rd 6 9 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - JORDY NELSON, WR
Rd 6 10 Hornsby - ANDREW LUCK, QB
Rd 6 11 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - BALTIMORE, D/ST
Rd 6 12 Piney Boy - BRANDON LLOYD, WR
Rd 7 1 Piney Boy - JONATHAN STEWART, RB
Rd 7 2 He Hate Me - DARIUS HEYWARD-BEY, WR
Rd 7 3 Hornsby - HAKEEM NICKS, WR
Rd 7 4 Bad News Kennels - PEYTON MANNING, QB
Rd 7 5 Schlesinj - CEDRIC BENSON, RB
Rd 7 6 Bad News Kennels - JUSTIN BLACKMON, WR
Rd 7 7 Schlesinj - ISAAC REDMAN, RB
Rd 7 8 Andy Reid Diet Plan - FRED DAVIS, TE
Rd 7 9 Diablowupdoll - ELI MANNING, QB
Rd 7 10 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - BEN ROETHLISBERGER, QB
Rd 7 11 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges- SHONN GREENE, RB
Rd 7 12 Griswolds - MARSHAWN LYNCH, RB
Rd 8 1 Griswolds - DARREN SPROLES, RB
Rd 8 2 Phreak's Playas - GREG LITTLE, WR
Rd 8 3 Iron City Lights - KENNY BRITT, WR
Rd 8 4 Diablowupdoll - BEANIE WELLS, RB
Rd 8 5 Andy Reid Diet Plan - RYAN WILLIAMS, RB
Rd 8 6 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - AARON HERNANDEZ, TE
Rd 8 7 Bad News Kennels - DEMARYIUS THOMAS, WR
Rd 8 8 G-G-G-G-Men - VICTOR CRUZ, WR
Rd 8 9 Griswolds - RASHAD JENNINGS, RB
Rd 8 10 Hornsby - CARSON PALMER, QB
Rd 8 11 He Hate Me - DONALD BROWN, RB
Rd 8 12 Piney Boy - ROY HELU, RB
Rd 9 1 Piney Boy - RASHARD MENDENHALL, RB
Rd 9 2 Diablowupdoll - TITUS YOUNG, WR
Rd 9 3 G-G-G-G-Men - KENDALL WRIGHT, WR
Rd 9 4 Iron City Lights - JAY CUTLER, QB
Rd 9 5 G-G-G-G-Men - MICHAEL BUSH, RB
Rd 9 6 Piney Boy - ROBERT MEACHEM, WR
Rd 9 7 Schlesinj - BRANDON PETTIGREW, TE
Rd 9 8 Andy Reid Diet Plan - KENDALL HUNTER, RB
Rd 9 9 Diablowupdoll - TOBY GERHART, RB
Rd 9 10 Iron City Lights - MIKEL LESHOURE, RB
Rd 9 11 Phreak's Playas - PIERRE THOMAS, RB
Rd 9 12 Griswolds - NATE WASHINGTON, WR
Rd 10 1 Griswolds - EVAN ROYSTER, RB
Rd 10 2 Phreak's Playas - ANQUAN BOLDIN, WR
Rd 10 3 Iron City Lights - MALCOM FLOYD, WR
Rd 10 4 Diablowupdoll - HOUSTON, D/ST
Rd 10 5 Andy Reid Diet Plan - LANCE MOORE, WR
Rd 10 6 Schlesinj - DENARIUS MOORE, WR
Rd 10 7 Bad News Kennels - SANTONIO HOLMES, WR
Rd 10 8 G-G-G-G-Men - ALSHON JEFFREY, WR
Rd 10 9 Phreak's Playas - DANNY AMENDOLA, WR
Rd 10 10 Hornsby - BUFFALO, D/ST
Rd 10 11 He Hate Me - RONNIE HILLMAN, RB
Rd 10 12 Piney Boy - TONY GONZALEZ, TE
Rd 11 1 Piney Boy - SIDNEY RICE, WR
Rd 11 2 He Hate Me - CAM NEWTON, QB
Rd 11 3 Hornsby - SEBASTIAN JANIKOWSKI, K
Rd 11 4 Schlesinj - LEGARRETTE BLOUNT, RB
Rd 11 5 G-G-G-G-Men - JAKE LOCKER, QB
Rd 11 6 Bad News Kennels - PHILADELPHIA, D/ST
Rd 11 7 Schlesinj - BILAL POWELL, RB
Rd 11 8 Andy Reid Diet Plan - NEW YORK GIANTS, D/ST
Rd 11 9 Diablowupdoll - ALFRED MORRIS, RB
Rd 11 10 Iron City Lights - RANDALL COBB, WR
Rd 11 11 Phreak's Playas - BRANDON LAFELL, WR
Rd 11 12 Griswolds - RONNIE BROWN, RB
Rd 12 1 Griswolds - MIKE WILLIAMS (TB), WR
Rd 12 2 Phreak's Playas - SHANE VEREEN, RB
Rd 12 3 Iron City Lights - BEN TATE, RB
Rd 12 4 Diablowupdoll - DEMARCO MURRAY, RB
Rd 12 5 Andy Reid Diet Plan - MICHAEL CRABTREE, WR
Rd 12 6 Schlesinj - JOSH FREEMAN, QB
Rd 12 7 Bad News Kennels - ROBERT TURBIN, RB
Rd 12 8 G-G-G-G-Men - RUSSELL WILSON, QB
Rd 12 9 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - ISIAH PEAD, RB
Rd 12 10 Hornsby - JONATHAN DWYER, RB
Rd 12 11 He Hate Me - FELIX JONES, RB
Rd 12 12 Piney Boy - MATT SCHAUB, QB
Rd 13 1 Piney Boy - GREEN BAY, D/ST
Rd 13 2 He Hate Me - RANDY MOSS, WR
Rd 13 3 Hornsby - ANTONIO BROWN, WR
Rd 13 4 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges - STEPHEN GOSTKOWSKI, K
Rd 13 5 G-G-G-G-Men - KYLE RUDOLPH, TE
Rd 13 6 Bad News Kennels - DUSTIN KELLER, TE
Rd 13 7 Schlesinj - PITTSBURGH, D/ST
Rd 13 8 Andy Reid Diet Plan - ANDY DALTON, QB
Rd 13 9 Diablowupdoll - JARED COOK, TE
Rd 13 10 Iron City Lights - JERMAINE GRESHAM, TE
Rd 13 11 Phreak's Playas - JONATHAN BALDWIN, WR
Rd 13 12 Griswolds - JACOB TAMME, TE
Rd 14 1 Griswolds - JOE FLACCO, QB
Rd 14 2 Phreak's Playas - CHICAGO, D/ST
Rd 14 3 Iron City Lights
Rd 14 4 Diablowupdoll
Rd 14 5 Andy Reid Diet Plan
Rd 14 6 Schlesinj
Rd 14 7 Bad News Kennels
Rd 14 8 G-G-G-G-Men
Rd 14 9 Non-Alcoholic Beveridges
Rd 14 10 Hornsby
Rd 14 11 He Hate Me
Rd 14 12 Piney Boy
Rd 15 1 Piney Boy
Rd 15 2 He Hate Me
Rd 15 3 Hornsby
Rd 15 4 Piney Boy
Rd 15 5 G-G-G-G-Men
Rd 15 6 Phreak's Playas
Rd 15 7 G-G-G-G-Men
Rd 15 8 Andy Reid Diet Plan
Rd 15 9 Diablowupdoll
Rd 15 10 Iron City Lights
Rd 15 11 Hornsby
Rd 15 12 Griswolds

[Trautdiggity]

Now that I've picked him (and stolen him from Erik) I'm curious to hear people's thoughts on Rudolph. I think he and Jared Cook are the two best breakout candidates at TE this season and for me Rudolph has all the physical tools needed to excel. The guys at rotoworld are on Rudolph big time (like top-10 for sure) but I've seen him ranked below 20 by some analysts. I'm not fully sure he will be a TE1 but once you get past the studs id much rather go with the upside pick.

[Erik]

Cook has been touted as a breakout guy for years and it's yet to happen. (However, I employed ElD's strategy in the Liz Hurley league and ended up with him as my TE1.) Rudolph has the physical tools to succeed and two circumstantial points in his favor: 1. A young QB who may need he employ his TE as a safety valve a lot and 2. A team with an unsettled situation at WR2. I've been grabbing him late when I can.

[Trautdiggity]

Cook has been touted as a breakout guy for years and it's yet to happen. (However, I employed ElD's strategy in the Liz Hurley league and ended up with him as my TE1.) Rudolph has the physical tools to succeed and two circumstantial points in his favor: 1. A young QB who may need he employ his TE as a safety valve a lot and 2. A team with an unsettled situation at WR2. I've been grabbing him late when I can.

You and I agree on Rudolph obviously but I actually really like Cook too. Sure he was a breakout candidate last season but he started just five games to Craig stevens' 9. Still he was third in receptions and had 3 of the teams' 22 TD catches. All this with a brutal QB mess last season and the first year in a new system. Likewise to Rudolph's second year QB cook catches balls from Jake Locker and Chris Palmer will look to sling it. If I'm taking one TE for a breakout it's Rudolph but if I miss out on him I'm happy to get Cook.

[frae]

This is a much more charitable assessment than I was expecting, since most teams are much better set at RB than I am.

Well I like the top two WR's. You need Williams or Rodgers, if you get 1 it can work. I am not as sold on Kendall Hunter, but we will see. The thing is most of us all have question marks, so if things break right anything could happen, but you will need the breaks to fall your way at RB. I will need my top 2 to stay healthy or the breaks to go my way with my backups.

[Hammer]

If we are using a 15 player roster limit SDS cannot add Gost. He is already at 15.

[schlesinj]

If we are using a 15 player roster limit SDS cannot add Gost. He is already at 15.

SDS has 14 players currently. Blout is on my roster.

[SeaDogStat]

If we are using a 15 player roster limit SDS cannot add Gost. He is already at 15.

I currently have 14 after taking Gostkowski

[SeaDogStat]

Non Alcoholic All Stars- Mike had a lot of early picks and used them to build a team that is deep across the board. Forte is a very good RB1 in PPR. MJD signed so he will be his RB2 for most of the seasons once he gets going. (note cbs site has mke with R. Jennings and he belongs on Gris team). Shonn Greene is the total opposite of a sexy pick, but at RB3 he can be solid. He will get carries and finding guys that will get carries is hard. Pead wont likely do much this year if Sjax is healthy he could be a nice keeper if Jackson were to be moved. Andre Johnson, Bowe, and Nelson make for a very nice group of WR's. AJ may not be #1 anymore but he is a going to be in the top 10. Jordy probably won't score as many TD's but still a nice option and who knows which Bowe you will get. Amendola could be good in PPR. I love Aaron Hernandez at TE. Matt Ryan has flown up draft boards in the last month. He has weapons around him if the offense clicks he could be a very good QB1. Big Ben is a solid backup. This team doesn't have any player that is likely to finish at the top of their position, but they have a lot of depth and should be hard to outscore each week.

Thanks for the analysis, Frae... I have AJ, Bowe, Jordy and Dez Bryant at WR. Forte, MJD, Shonn and Adrian Peterson as my RB. Pead is my 5th RB looking more toward next year for him. I would have taken Brady but Gris snaked him from unexpectedly (Gris with a first round QB?!? I'm not proofing his book next year lol)