Anyone see him? He looks like he's lost 40 lbs. I expect a big bounceback year from CC, and at his ADP, he's a virtual steal.
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2k14: CC Sabathia
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Originally posted by eldiablo505I expect him to be better than last year but fear that his best days are behind him. His peripherals pointed to a better performance than the one he got last year when he got unlucky. So, bounceback....sure. Big bounceback? I wouldn't want to be the one to pay for that.
Velocity markedly down, K rate falling.....I think his stuff may be failing him. That may not be an enormous surprise given his massive workload over the last decade. Perhaps he can turn to finesse in a more effective manner this year but, again, I'm probably not the guy who's going to throw out $20 or whatever to find out.Only the madman is absolutely sure. -Robert Anton Wilson, novelist (1932-2007)
Faith is believing what you know ain't so. -Mark Twain, author and humorist (1835-1910)
A great many people think they are thinking when they are merely rearranging their prejudices.
-- William James
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Originally posted by eldiablo505I expect him to be better than last year but fear that his best days are behind him. His peripherals pointed to a better performance than the one he got last year when he got unlucky. So, bounceback....sure. Big bounceback? I wouldn't want to be the one to pay for that.
Velocity markedly down, K rate falling.....I think his stuff may be failing him. That may not be an enormous surprise given his massive workload over the last decade. Perhaps he can turn to finesse in a more effective manner this year but, again, I'm probably not the guy who's going to throw out $20 or whatever to find out.
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Originally posted by Moonlight J View PostNeed to see where the velo is before investing. Let's not forget how awful the infield defense is going to be behind him at 2B, SS, and 3B. I'm knocking all Yankee pitchers down $2 or a round based on that infield. It's wretched.Last edited by DMT; 03-01-2014, 11:00 AM.If DMT didn't exist we would have to invent it. There has to be a weirdest thing. Once we have the concept weird, there has to be a weirdest thing. And DMT is simply it.
- Terence McKenna
Bullshit is everywhere. - George Carlin (& Jon Stewart)
How old would you be if you didn't know how old you are? - Satchel Paige
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Absolutely nothing in his 2013 stats to indicate that he'll comeback significantly at all, walked more people, K'd less, didn't have a BABIP that was wildly out of line, and his fastball was down to 91 MPH. Now, can he learn how to pitch with reduced stuff, sure, WILL he learn, no way to tell. But I won't have him on any of my teams unless he falls quite a bit in price, and that won't happen."Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
- Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
"Your shitty future continues to offend me."
-Warren Ellis
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Originally posted by DMT View PostBut let's not forget, as part of Jeter's farewell tour, every hitter has promised to hit him at least one routine grounder per game.
Have they also promised him a meatball pitch for a HR in his last All-Star appearance, like they did for Cal and Mariano's "MVP" performance last year?
Baseball's All-Star Game is becoming more like the NBA's every year.Only the madman is absolutely sure. -Robert Anton Wilson, novelist (1932-2007)
Faith is believing what you know ain't so. -Mark Twain, author and humorist (1835-1910)
A great many people think they are thinking when they are merely rearranging their prejudices.
-- William James
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Originally posted by Hornsby View PostAbsolutely nothing in his 2013 stats to indicate that he'll comeback significantly at all, walked more people, K'd less, didn't have a BABIP that was wildly out of line, and his fastball was down to 91 MPH. Now, can he learn how to pitch with reduced stuff, sure, WILL he learn, no way to tell. But I won't have him on any of my teams unless he falls quite a bit in price, and that won't happen.
Were those stats you're referring to down across the board in '13? Yes, but:
- his K% was the same exact rate as it was in 2010, when he went 21-7
- His BB% was lower than what it was in 2010
- his average FB velocity was still the same or higher than King Felix, Cole Hamels, Adam Wainwright, Madison Bumgarner & Mike Minor.
Take a look at this elite pitcher's plunge in average FB velocity:
'07 - 96.3
'08 - 94.5
'09 - 93.8
'10 - 94.4
'11 - 93.4
'12 - 92.4
'13 - 91.3
So should we be concerned about King Felix?
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Originally posted by revo View PostI really wouldn't go that far.
Were those stats you're referring to down across the board in '13? Yes, but:
- his K% was the same exact rate as it was in 2010, when he went 21-7
- His BB% was lower than what it was in 2010
- his average FB velocity was still the same or higher than King Felix, Cole Hamels, Adam Wainwright, Madison Bumgarner & Mike Minor.
Take a look at this elite pitcher's plunge in average FB velocity:
'07 - 96.3
'08 - 94.5
'09 - 93.8
'10 - 94.4
'11 - 93.4
'12 - 92.4
'13 - 91.3
So should we be concerned about King Felix?
Sabathia's xERA rose from 3.29 to 3.89, his Dom fell from 8.9 to 7.5, and his Ctl rose from 2.0 to 2.8.
Given a choice about whom to be concerned, guess who I choose?Only the madman is absolutely sure. -Robert Anton Wilson, novelist (1932-2007)
Faith is believing what you know ain't so. -Mark Twain, author and humorist (1835-1910)
A great many people think they are thinking when they are merely rearranging their prejudices.
-- William James
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Originally posted by revo View PostI really wouldn't go that far.
Were those stats you're referring to down across the board in '13? Yes, but:
- his K% was the same exact rate as it was in 2010, when he went 21-7
- His BB% was lower than what it was in 2010
- his average FB velocity was still the same or higher than King Felix, Cole Hamels, Adam Wainwright, Madison Bumgarner & Mike Minor.
Take a look at this elite pitcher's plunge in average FB velocity:
'07 - 96.3
'08 - 94.5
'09 - 93.8
'10 - 94.4
'11 - 93.4
'12 - 92.4
'13 - 91.3
So should we be concerned about King Felix?"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake."
- Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
"Your shitty future continues to offend me."
-Warren Ellis
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Originally posted by Hornsby View PostNo, because it's patently obvious that Felix has adapted to his decreased velocity, it remains to be seen if CC can do the same. Will he still have value? Sure...but he's not going to be on any of my teams since I won't pay the premium price.
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Originally posted by Moonlight J View Post
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Originally posted by Moonlight J View Post
"CC Sabathia’s fastball velocity flared into an issue in Yankee camp Saturday when the lefty reached only 88 mph on the radar gun while throwing two scoreless innings against the Phillies."
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Originally posted by eldiablo505Mechanical issues, injuries, and velocity problems are infinitely more important and relevant as predictors of future success and failure than is throwing two meaningless innings. Last year, Phillip Humber, Chris Rusin, Paul Maholm, Brandon Maurer, JA Happ, and Lucas Harrell were all top 10 for ERA during Spring Training. Sabathia's decrease in velocity is significantly more concerning than his success over two innings is encouraging.
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