Larkin Elected to HOF

[The Dane]

couldn't they send them a Christmas card instead? Votes like that water down the importance of the HOF vote process. If you're a sportswriter and are throwing a few votes to your buddies, that's kind of ridiculous.

I suppose, but that is further indication of the type of network these voters run in. I think being a nice guy to the writers matters WAY more than we think we think it should. This is why there is no question in my mind that Bonds will never get in. Even if there had been no steroids allegations, he would have had trouble getting past the writers, and WITH the allegations, no chance. McGuire has a better chance, even though he was less of a player, on or off the juice.

[willthethrill]

I was hoping that Raines would see a big jump this year, and agree with the pro-Tim Raines sentiment. He's a victim of being compared to Rickey Henderson, who was awesome.

[Moonlight J]

read raines30.com

[revo]

You're forgetting about strike-shortened 1981, when he was on a pace to challenge Henderson's record for stolen bases in a season. He had a mediocre year in '88 but bounced back and remained very productive through 1993. His stolen base success rate is out of this world. We love Tony Gwynn here in San Diego but I have a hard time saying that Gwynn was a significantly better or more valuable player, all things considered.

Obviously Raines has his supporters and his vote % has increased each year he's been on the ballot. He may get in one day.

Do the Raines supporters also feel Kenny Lofton is a HOFer? His career is amazingly similar to Raines.

[Erik]

Even if there had been no steroids allegations, he would have had trouble getting past the writers

That's taking it too far the other way. These are the same people who voted him all those MVPs, some of which came after the steroid rumors were circulating.

[The Dane]

That's taking it too far the other way. These are the same people who voted him all those MVPs, some of which came after the steroid rumors were circulating.

They actually AREN'T the same people, I don't think. I'm sure some are, but it's a different pool. I feel very certain that -sans steroids and the allegations- Bonds would have not been a first-ballot HoFer, even though he probably deserved to be.

[Erik]

If his career numbers ended up the same with no talk of steroids, he'd top the 90% mark easily on the first ballot. And some folks would whine about the 5-9% that didn't vote for him.

[Erik]

They actually AREN'T the same people, I don't think. I'm sure some are, but it's a different pool. I feel very certain that -sans steroids and the allegations- Bonds would have not been a first-ballot HoFer, even though he probably deserved to be.

In many cases they are. You get a HOF vote if you've been a BBWAA member long enough (10 years, I think). Awards votes rotate each year, 2 BBWAA members from each metropolitan area with a team. Almost everyone who voted Bonds for MVP at some point has been a member long enough to have a HOF vote now.

[Fresno Bob]

A Hall of Fame without Bonds is a joke

[Moonlight J]

Obviously Raines has his supporters and his vote % has increased each year he's been on the ballot. He may get in one day.

Do the Raines supporters also feel Kenny Lofton is a HOFer? His career is amazingly similar to Raines.

B-Ref has Lofton over Raines by a win or two
BaseballProspectus has Raines by 15 wins
Fangraphs has them 4 wins apart in Raines favor


If I had a ballot next year, I'd fill all 10 spots with Bagwell, Raines, Trammell, Edgar, Biggio, Piazza, Bonds, Palmeiro, McGwire, McGriff

[The Dane]

A Hall of Fame without Bonds is a joke

Yes, but it's already a Hall without Shoeless Joe and Pete Rose, so it's kind of already a joke. Can you imagine the Hall in 20 years and there is no Bonds, Clemens, McGwire, Manny, ARod....

[TS Garp]

McGriff

No way.

[owned]

Can you imagine the Hall in 20 years and there is no Bonds, Clemens, McGwire, Manny, ARod....

an Emphatically, YES I can!

[owned]

Although Tim Salmon & Vinny Castilla were clearly not HOF worthy, they were perennial All Stars and so I can understand a few votes going for them. But four votes for Bill Mueller??? Two for Brad Radke?

Kingfish never made an All Star team.

[Skrappy1]

interesting that Juan Gonzalez is now gone from the ballot. I thought he'd manage more than 4% - 5%.

I imagine he would have (and should have) stayed on the ballot longer had he not been included on the Mitchell Report. He was a 2-time AL MVP after-all.