Progress

[Bob Kohm]

From CNN's belief blog: the end of religion in nine countries: http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2011/0...redict/?hpt=C2

As I have often said, belief in God is good if it's your thing, but belief in a body of ritual and mythology that not only comes between a person and their beliefs but also screws up society and international peace is not only bad but in direct contravention to what the alleged desire of most religions is.

[B-Fly]

Imagine all the people...living for today...woo-hoo-ooh-ooh-ooh.

[GwynnInTheHall]

Imagine all the people...living for today...woo-hoo-ooh-ooh-ooh.

You the man!

[Gregg]

From CNN's belief blog: the end of religion in nine countries: http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2011/0...redict/?hpt=C2

As I have often said, belief in God is good if it's your thing, but belief in a body of ritual and mythology that not only comes between a person and their beliefs but also screws up society and international peace is not only bad but in direct contravention to what the alleged desire of most religions is.

Your comment is one of the saddest things I have ever read since I have known you...

[johnnya24]

Your comment is one of the saddest things I have ever read since I have known you...

[Controller Jacobs]

Who are all the Irish going to confess to?

[SeaDogStat]

Who are all the Irish going to confess to?

Same as always...a bottle of Jameson's

[nots]

Your comment is one of the saddest things I have ever read since I have known you...

The quote itself or the fact he would (again) go out of his way to provoke and belittle people who don't think like him?

[DMT]

The quote itself or the fact he would (again) go out of his way to provoke and belittle people who don't think like him?

Anyone who is saddened by the latter has already killed themselves.

[Jefe]

Ban the troll!

[Bob Kohm]

The quote itself or the fact he would (again) go out of his way to provoke and belittle people who don't think like him?

Oh please. Religion is dying out in Ireland-- that's a paradigm shift worth noticing unless, no? Given the state of affairs in the world, it is indisputable that religion is separating people and arguable that it is dividing us more than it unites us. This is an important trend.

[Bob Kohm]

Your comment is one of the saddest things I have ever read since I have known you...

I can imagine that you think so given your belief structure, Gregg, but it is in my opinion not only the happiest but perhaps the "holiest" news that could come out of a discussion of the divine. Losing the ritual and relating to the universe/god/math/whatever your perception of divinity is as an inhabitant of the same sphere in a relationship based on what the universe has given us to observe it was brings us much closer to the divine than the endless repetition of some hymn or the call of the Muzzein ever will, Gregg. For more and perhaps much more than 25,000 years we have fought, divided, and exhibited incredible cruelty over religious ritual in pursuit of coming closer to an almost universal idea of something "other" than us that we struggle to come to terms with and yet we are no closer in a world riven by any matter of man made disasters from greed to poverty to the destrution of the environment. It's not working. I don't understand why, in the pursuit of something not of this earth, so many of us still insist on conducting that search through something as unbearably earthy as religious ritual.

[nots]

Oh please. Religion is dying out in Ireland-- that's a paradigm shift worth noticing unless, no? Given the state of affairs in the world, it is indisputable that religion is separating people and arguable that it is dividing us more than it unites us. This is an important trend.

Oh please yourself. You open up the thread calling religion 'mythology'; now you back track to talking about a 'paradigm shift'. The quote above invites discussion. The quote that starts the thread is low level, axe grinding by someone who espouses tolerance to everyone except those he doesn't agree with. The saddest thing in the whole thread is not that you once again go out of your way to mock other people's core beliefs--it's that after doing it, you write the nonsense above. Wear your intolerance proudly, Bobby!

[Bob Kohm]

Oh please yourself. You open up the thread calling religion 'mythology'; now you back track to talking about a 'paradigm shift'. The quote above invites discussion. The quote that starts the thread is low level, axe grinding by someone who espouses tolerance to everyone except those he doesn't agree with. The saddest thing in the whole thread is not that you once again go out of your way to mock other people's core beliefs--it's that after doing it, you write the nonsense above. Wear your intolerance proudly, Bobby!

Religion is by definition mythology and mythology by definition religion--

my·thol·o·gy (m-thl-j)
n. pl. my·thol·o·gies
1.
a. A body or collection of myths belonging to a people and addressing their origin, history, deities, ancestors, and heroes.

re·li·gion (r-ljn)
n.
1.
a. Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe.
b. A personal or institutionalized system grounded in such belief and worship.

Where's the argument with that definition? Nobody argues with the concept of "Roman Mythology" or "Greek Mythology", yet these bodies of mythology were the sacred religions of those peoples and the term is used interchangeably. Religion is a body of anecdotes that prescribes ritual expressions of belief in those anecdotes; in other words, a mythology. If that concept offends you I'd suggest that a bit more thought on your part might be called for.

The quote that starts the thread is a statement of opinion, apparently one that inspires a strong reaction in you given the intemperate and immediate loss of perspective it caused in you. That proves the point that the CNN piece is an important and surprising study that should be discussed. Is the loss of religion in the world progress? In my opinion, yes, absolutely on a number of fronts-- religion divides us and is the inspiration for untold suffering that is almost universally the antithesis of what the core values of the religion call for-- there is clear evidence that it is a dysfunctional system. There was a time when religion substituted for the framework of civil society as necessitated by the lack of general education and the need to keep order. That time has almost universally passed with the advent of a wider literacy and the attendant strengthening of society, especially in the more developed nations. If you look at the populations that this study suggests are jettisoning a reliance on religion to place a buffer between them and the wider realities of the universe we see nations like Canada, Ireland, Australia, New Zealand, The Netherlands, Switzerland, Austria, the Czech Republic, Finland, all highly developed nations with a strong sense of civil society and high literacy rates, two of the major factors that argue for the obsolescence of old style religion. What the study does not say is that these people have lost a belief in god. I see this mirrored someplace else in society-- the move away from identifying with established political parties in many developed countries, including the United States, as people feel empowered to make decisions based upon their own direct perceptions rather than having to rely upon a packaged set of philosophies; the parallel between that and people in literate and scientifically advanced societies feeling comfortable with relying upon their direct perceptions to relate to god/the universe seems clear.

[PaleoMan]

I have mixed feelings. Yes, organized religion can be manipulative and damaging in some contexts with fraudulent messengers, but you don't want people to lose their sense of spirituality. I think a turn-away from the natural world, when man starts worshiping himself is a very ominous trigger point. It's a situation where you're comfortable with a devil you know as opposed to whatever could possibly replace it, because the current trendline I see, sure as hell isn't logic. Much of this move is predicated on feelings, which can betray you.