WRGPT 2011 (massive email poker thing)

[johnnya24]

Min raise (well slightly more). Early position raiser.

That's usually very strong ... I don't think you have much fold equity if you shove.

Some options:

Fold. I don't think I want to be folding this. JTs is a nice hand to take a stand with. Against an early raiser, you are likely in better shape than if you had AT, maybe even AJ.

Call. You will still have a playable short stack if you want call to see a flop ... although you will need to take a stand on the next circuit if you don't win the hand.

Call. With the intention of shoving a friendly flop.

Raise. Standard raise is out of the question.

Shove. It's an option if you feel like gambling. I prefer to have a little more fold equity than this spot seems to have.

I guess I like calling and reevaluating on the flop.

[senorsheep]

He's not gonna fold if you shove pre-flop. He might fold if you shove on the flop. So, you have more fold equity after the flop - call and see what you get, and be prepared to move all-in if the board is favorable. Like johnny said, you still have (barely) enough to play on even if you get a bad flop and have to fold.

[johnnya24]

He's not gonna fold if you shove pre-flop. He might fold if you shove on the flop. So, you have more fold equity after the flop - call and see what you get, and be prepared to move all-in if the board is favorable. Like johnny said, you still have (barely) enough to play on even if you get a bad flop and have to fold.

If he gets 3 overcards on the flop he can just let it go

[DMT]

Good flop for you, shove.

[johnnya24]

Good flop for you, shove.

I would say an OK flop ... certainly a better spot to shove than preflop. If his opponent has a legit hand, the only hand I can see him folding is AQ or AJ. Any pair should call to a shove here.

I wouldn't be that comfortable with shoving here, but I'd still likely stick it in and hope.

[baldgriff]

I called. Flop is Ks 8d 7h. I have Js 10s.

The infamous double belly buster. The only thing that calls you is Kx or a set.

[johnnya24]

The infamous double belly buster. The only thing that calls you is Kx or a set.

Not sure I agree with that. Any pair should call ... classic stop-go spot ... in fact any legit early position raise hand should be calling on that board ... most of the time an Ace is going to be good in this spot.

P.S. not a double belly buster.

[baldgriff]

Ooops my bad in reading the cards. not a double just a gut draw, with backdoor flush draw. I still think if you push a K will call, any other pair may have odds to call, but I havent looked at that.

[baldgriff]

Just won a nice little hand with second pair. Now at $90k was dealt A4 suited in 1st position and folded. Man I really wanted to play that hand, but I didnt want to put back the little gain I just made being obligated to call a push.

[DMT]

He had pocket 4s and called. I'm all but out now.

Huh? You're almost a coin flip (45%).

[heyelander]

Huh? You're almost a coin flip (45%).

that's prior to the flop, no? He's already missed on 3 cards.

[johnnya24]

He had pocket 4s and called. I'm all but out now.

That's about the best you could have hoped for given that flop. 10 outs twice.

Like DMT says ... almost a coin flip, and you had all the fold equity. Hand played itself really. You had to shove, he had to call. Good luck.

Edit: "can't win 'em all"

[heyelander]

doh.. forgot the straight draws.

Yep, got that you lost, just trying to follow along.

[senorsheep]

I'm not sure if the other guy was an idiot or a genius, but I never would have put a short stack on Pocket 4's based on a min raise.

[baldgriff]

Dealt 3 4 off suit in the big blind. Fold around to the button and he raises $6000. SB folds and I call the $6k. Pot now $23K

Flop comes 56A rainbow. I lead out for $7500.

Thoughts.... (other than wtf on the preflop call). That can be discussed also, I suppose. I just dont like being run over by the button - and historically I have been folding unless I have a hand.