Privilege

[heyelander]

err... Privilege (I wish I could edit the title of a thread)

I'm so happy for Gith and his daughter that I didn't want to clutter up the other thread with this... but this quote from Lucky really struck me.

It means so much to have a concerned parent there, and means the world when you have a polite young lady like your daughter who is smart, involved in school activities, and generally well rounded. The courts see her as the type of young person we need more of, and not someone we should hammer whenever possible.

I hear conservative talk show hosts talk about how everyone has the same opportunities and how people just need to take advantage of them and make something of themselves... I see friends from High School post about how they are part of the 53% or whatever that pay taxes and how they earned everything they ever had. Then I see things like this and I'm reminded that, probably most of us, but at least I was set up for success. I had the latitude to screw up a number of times along the way... got in a bit of trouble as a kid... failed out of college once... generally am not the most industrious person on the planet, but I had the background and support that pretty much assured, unless I really really screwed things up, I was going to be successful. I got my second chances, my third... probably a fourth and fifth. Then there are the portions of society that the establishment and the courts think we need less of. Who may not have that concerned parent, who don't have school activities, who aren't well rounded... yeah, maybe they have the same opportunity (doubtful) but they have to get it all right. Right from the start, do EVERYTHING right.

I don't know what to do with that, other than to not delude myself that I am some sort of self-made man, and see that the deck is stacked.

[Fresno Bob]

I know that I had every advantage, and that my kids have even more, and have made it very clear to them that they are not special snowflakes and that my expectations for them are high. I've had numerous people tell me that I'm too harsh in this respect, but I don't care, as I saw numerous of my peers carried by their parents into adulthood because no one ever held them to any kind of standard or expectation.

[Lucky]

err... Privilege (I wish I could edit the title of a thread)

I'm so happy for Gith and his daughter that I didn't want to clutter up the other thread with this... but this quote from Lucky really struck me.



I hear conservative talk show hosts talk about how everyone has the same opportunities and how people just need to take advantage of them and make something of themselves... I see friends from High School post about how they are part of the 53% or whatever that pay taxes and how they earned everything they ever had. Then I see things like this and I'm reminded that, probably most of us, but at least I was set up for success. I had the latitude to screw up a number of times along the way... got in a bit of trouble as a kid... failed out of college once... generally am not the most industrious person on the planet, but I had the background and support that pretty much assured, unless I really really screwed things up, I was going to be successful. I got my second chances, my third... probably a fourth and fifth. Then there are the portions of society that the establishment and the courts think we need less of. Who may not have that concerned parent, who don't have school activities, who aren't well rounded... yeah, maybe they have the same opportunity (doubtful) but they have to get it all right. Right from the start, do EVERYTHING right.

I don't know what to do with that, other than to not delude myself that I am some sort of self-made man, and see that the deck is stacked.

Yeah, I'm afraid that is right. Courts do look to those traits that Doig's daughter displayed, and they do make a huge difference in the majority of cases. That's not to say that all judges and all cases work that way. Some judges will look a little deeper at the circumstances, and dig to find redeeming qualities. They're usually called "liberal" judges, and that is a lot of what cost me my job.

But here is another quote from that thread which puts Doig's case in a little different perspective:

"I would also like to relay all of this to my son. Every kid can learn from a story where a young person, even if they make a mistake, can do the right thing and earn themselves a second chance."

So it wasn't so much about being privileged. It was about learning from a mistake and doing the right thing.

You really think your deck was stacked? You wanna share that?

[heyelander]

So it wasn't so much about being privileged. It was about learning from a mistake and doing the right thing.

You really think your deck was stacked? You wanna share that?

I don't think it's active privilege so much as the passive privilege of being the kind of person who society is willing to give the benefit of the doubt to. Has she learned? I hope so, I imagine she has actually, but that's me giving her the benefit of the doubt. however much of it seems to be what GITH has done... it's obvious this is being taken seriously at home so the court has some latitude to take it less seriously. I don't think it's her learning so much as her situation that is allowing for the best possible outcome here. At least it's not 100% her actions. And too many of us like to pretend that it is entirely our actions that get us where we are.

Was my deck stacked, hell yes. I have two parents that gave me their full attention, were well enough off to provide me with numerous opportunities, we lived in a county with the second best public school system in the country. A district that was progressive enough to have one of the first magnet school program in the country for gifted and talented, teachers who identified me early, a system that was willing to bus me to better schools for a better education. Parents who, even when my grades sucked because of my own apathy continued to push me... who guided me through hard times, and covered for me, while disciplining me when I screwed up. Because I'm an affable, white male, from an upper middle class family, i've had plenty of opportunities to try to find my way, screw things, up, start over, coast, get serious, screw them up again, recommit, coast, whatever and still, inevitably end up just where I was always going to end up without a grand flame out, a white, uppermiddle-class male. To pretend that I am self-made and not in anyway a product of my situation is silly.

[Lucky]

It sounds like you have spent some time analyzing your own path. But I would note that even after going off the rails more than once, you always got back on and had success. That takes some determination and hard work. It sounds like you are selling yourself short.

[heyelander]

It sounds like you have spent some time analyzing your own path. But I would note that even after going off the rails more than once, you always got back on and had success. That takes some determination and hard work. It sounds like you are selling yourself short.

No, I realize that... I know that I've done at least the bare minimum to be successful. I've put in my time. I'm just saying that not everyone gets a second chance, let along a fifth to get things right and that the situations that allow for those extra chances aren't always fair or our own creation.

[heyelander]

thanks for hooking me up mod.

[mjl]

http://whatever.scalzi.com/2012/05/1...ting-there-is/ is a good way to think about it. Also http://whatever.scalzi.com/2014/07/1...ing-in-action/ for data.

My story is a lot like heye's; I dropped out of college for a quarter because I hadn't been taking it seriously for a while and my grades showed it, and I left without actually getting a degree, but it's hard to say that that's impacted me much. My family has taken care of me when necessary and let me find my footing again until such time as I felt like being a decent contributing member of society again, which is a saving grace that a lot of people don't get. And my sister has had a much rougher life - drugs in high school, dropped out of grad school after getting through a low-end college, married a total dead-ender, has run up massive debt many times - and although her life is pretty stressful now, it'd be horrific without my parents (and occasionally me) helping her out.

It's great that Doig's kid appears to be taking all this seriously and is getting redirected in a productive manner, and learning from a mistake and doing the right thing is great and all, but there are a lot of people who make that mistake and never get the chance to show that they've learned from it. Look back at the original thread - a lot of people who get busted for hitting someone with their car, fleeing the scene, and possession of drug paraphernalia don't end up with the option of having it be recorded as a misdemeanor with no jail time, no criminal history, and no long-term implications other than that they've learned a lesson.

[chancellor]

While Scalzi's article isn't the dumbest piece of crap I've read on the internet, it does rate in the top 100.

Great parents are the absolute greatest privilege child can have; vastly greater than race, gender, sexual orientation, income level, intelligence, physical ability and so on.