Dick Cheney

[Kevin Seitzer]

Doesn't the "conservative" part of conservative Christian make it inherently political? But to answer what I think your question is, yes Dick Cheney is the embodiment of a hypocritical brand of thinking that allows one to somehow reconcile war, torture, unbridled greed, hatred of immigrants, distaste for the poor, and wholesale intolerance with all the stuff that the son of god so inconveniently stood for.

I'm a bit troubled by this, actually, for a couple reasons. I suppose the simple thing would be to say, "yeah, you're right", and leave it at that. But two things bug me about that.

One is that I'm guessing that, for all that I find many, many things about Dick Cheney distasteful, he's probably not quite the flat character you are portraying him as here. For example, his views on gay marriage don't exactly line up with the views of conservative Christians on that topic.

Secondly, while I absolutely hate how conservative Christians in the U.S. have propagated hatred for gay people, poor people, immigrants, Muslims, etc., I have also seen conservative Christians reach out to help poor people, prisoners, immigrants, those who have suffered natural disasters, the sick, the elderly, etc., more times than I can even begin to count. Yes, that's paradoxical, and the two sides of the coin shouldn't coexist among people who say they follow Jesus Christ. It sickens me that this is the case.

I have a litany of issues with conservative Christian thought and practice. But I don't agree with painting it all with the broad brush of hatred and intolerance and thinking that covers it. And I suspect it probably doesn't cover Cheney, either, despite the heavy responsibility he bears for torturing and killing innocent people, and his disgusting lack of remorse for the evil he committed.

Edit to add: One of the things that irks me deeply about conservative Christianity in the U.S. is the conflation of God and Country. You seem to imply something similar in your comments about Cheney, and if so, I agree.

[GwynnInTheHall]

I'm a bit troubled by this, actually, for a couple reasons. I suppose the simple thing would be to say, "yeah, you're right", and leave it at that. But two things bug me about that.

One is that I'm guessing that, for all that I find many, many things about Dick Cheney distasteful, he's probably not quite the flat character you are portraying him as here. For example, his views on gay marriage don't exactly line up with the views of conservative Christians on that topic.

Secondly, while I absolutely hate how conservative Christians in the U.S. have propagated hatred for gay people, poor people, immigrants, Muslims, etc., I have also seen conservative Christians reach out to help poor people, prisoners, immigrants, those who have suffered natural disasters, the sick, the elderly, etc., more times than I can even begin to count. Yes, that's paradoxical, and the two sides of the coin shouldn't coexist among people who say they follow Jesus Christ. It sickens me that this is the case.

I have a litany of issues with conservative Christian thought and practice. But I don't agree with painting it all with the broad brush of hatred and intolerance and thinking that covers it. And I suspect it probably doesn't cover Cheney, either, despite the heavy responsibility he bears for torturing and killing innocent people, and his disgusting lack of remorse for the evil he committed.

Edit to add: One of the things that irks me deeply about conservative Christianity in the U.S. is the conflation of God and Country. You seem to imply something similar in your comments about Cheney, and if so, I agree.

There is good and bad in all of us....Ebony and Ivory.....Cheney may have his qualities, but the man lied the country into war, profited from that war and is unapologetic of torturing others and has flatly said that he doesn't care if he killed an innocent man to protect America and that he'd do it again. If I had a vote, it would be to turn him over to ISIS and be done with him.

[onejayhawk]

There is good and bad in all of us....Ebony and Ivory.....Cheney may have his qualities, but the man lied the country into war, profited from that war and is unapologetic of torturing others and has flatly said that he doesn't care if he killed an innocent man to protect America and that he'd do it again. If I had a vote, it would be to turn him over to ISIS and be done with him.

So you condone torture. Good to know.

J

[GwynnInTheHall]

So you condone torture. Good to know.

J

NO I condone the death penalty...........

[Kevin Seitzer]

There is good and bad in all of us....Ebony and Ivory.....Cheney may have his qualities, but the man lied the country into war, profited from that war and is unapologetic of torturing others and has flatly said that he doesn't care if he killed an innocent man to protect America and that he'd do it again. If I had a vote, it would be to turn him over to ISIS and be done with him.

I wasn't addressing a question about whether I/we liked Dick Cheney. It was a question of whether he is a good representative of conservative Christianity.

[DMT]

I wasn't addressing a question about whether I/we liked Dick Cheney. It was a question of whether he is a good representative of conservative Christianity.

You mention his views on gay marriage in your last post and I'm curious if he was as supportive before he knew his daughter was a lesbian? I don't know.

[Kevin Seitzer]

Doesn't the "conservative" part of conservative Christian make it inherently political? But to answer what I think your question is, yes Dick Cheney is the embodiment of a hypocritical brand of thinking that allows one to somehow reconcile war, torture, unbridled greed, hatred of immigrants, distaste for the poor, and wholesale intolerance with all the stuff that the son of god so inconveniently stood for.

Put another way, I think this way of expressing things, while containing a small grain of truth, is as unhelpful as saying that Cheney is a perfect representative of rich, old white men. It doesn't advance the discussion. It's just a way to throw around insults at a group you don't like.

[In the Corn]

[GwynnInTheHall]

Put another way, I think this way of expressing things, while containing a small grain of truth, is as unhelpful as saying that Cheney is a perfect representative of rich, old white men. It doesn't advance the discussion. It's just a way to throw around insults at a group you don't like.

I think the grain is much bigger than you're stating and what's wrong with vilifying a group that seems to be everything that's wrong with our society today?

[In the Corn]

That was helpful and it advanced the discussion! Nice work.

Eld - your opinion is your opinion, but imagine if you could be as open-minded as you want, no expect, everyone else to be when listening to you. Dick Cheney is not anywhere near the people that I associate with on a daily-basis that are conservative Christians. To be sure, their are many throughout the nation who spew what you say, but they have poor theology that has been clouded by the lens of American society placed over their Christian values (in essence, they value being an American more than a Christian). This is poor theology. I think you would be surprised by the younger segment in the church, even the evangelical church. While they won't give up in on what scripture states, they don't have an expectation of those that are Christ-followers to live according to Christ's commands.

Please don't lump us all into a pigeon-hole. That stereotyping, in some realms, would be called bigotry...but hey, that's just my opinion.

Oh, and one last note...what's wrong with saying that someone has stated something very well, and you agree with it. KS stated it very well, and I wanted to show support.

[johnnya24]

How about Dick Cheney is to Christianity what ISIL is to Islam.

[Fresno Bob]

I think Antonin Scalia is more representative of the downside of conservative Christianity than Cheney

[Lucky]

Does anyone know what Cheney claims himself to be, religion-wise? I know his is listed as a "Methodist", which is generally on the liberal end of the American religious scale. I can't remember him invoking religion to justify his evil actions, as would someone who scrambled their politics and their religion together too tightly.

[onejayhawk]

Does anyone know what Cheney claims himself to be, religion-wise? I know his is listed as a "Methodist", which is generally on the liberal end of the American religious scale. I can't remember him invoking religion to justify his evil actions, as would someone who scrambled their politics and their religion together too tightly.

I have never seen any connection between any religious group and Cheney. KOSites refer to neo-cons. Cheney is that if anything.

I think Antonin Scalia is more representative of the downside of conservative Christianity than Cheney

Same as Cheney. If you want a SCOTUS example, probably Thomas. Roberts may merge into that meme.

J