Election 2020

[Sour Masher]

why was Joe so horrible in early states buy is now unstoppable ? Ask yourself how that happened ?

Do you think it is rigged? Russian bots voting. I thoughr you were crit8cal of conspiracy theories. All the time stablishmant people rallying around the centrist front runner was always a given. That certainly helps, but I do not know how that actually flips massive numbers of voters in just a few days. More likely, we see people running to what they think is safety when push is coming to shove.

[The Feral Slasher]

Do you think it is rigged? Russian bots voting. I thoughr you were crit8cal of co spiracy theories. All the time stablishmwnt people rallying around the centrist front runner was always a given. I do not know how thst actually flios mqssive numbers of voters in just a few days. More likely, we see people running to what they think is safety when push is coming to shove.

kinda hard to read your stuff. Anyway, no, it's not rigged, but it's pretty clear that the Democratic party let Pete and Amy know if was time to take a seat and fall in line. And Joe has been around long enough that he has the full support of the Democratic party. And that matters a lot. Do you disagree ?

[Sour Masher]

There’s got to be a reason why Trump risked making illegal deals with a foreign government to smear Biden - the one candidate he fears. I just hope everyone jumps on the beat Trump bandwagon

Yes, I have made this point before. It seemed clear Trump saw Biden as his greatest threat. I guess he really is politically savvy, as I did not think Biden would emerge the victor in this large, competitive field.

[Sour Masher]

kinda hard to read your stuff. Anyway, no, it's not rigged, but it's pretty clear that the Democratic party let Pete and Amy know if was time to take a seat and fall in line. And Joe has been around long enough that he has the full support of the Democratic party. And that matters a lot. Do you disagree ?

I type poorly on my phone. I edited for clarity. See my previous post. I do disagree, somewhat. You cannot point to or blame, imo, Biden's win all on endorsements and establishment support. We all knew he would always have that. Many of us thought it would not he enough to overcome Bernie. I think something else is in play. If enough voters were true believers in Bernie, this surge to Biden would not have happened, endorsements or not. It seems to me many voters had weak commitments and were easily swayed to Biden. It must have been in them to flee to perceived safety. It was not in GOP voters in 2016. They went with the anti-establishment candidate despite just as big an effort to stop him from within that party.

[The Feral Slasher]

There’s got to be a reason why Trump risked making illegal deals with a foreign government to smear Biden - the one candidate he fears. I just hope everyone jumps on the beat Trump bandwagon

Right, its so not like Trump to make illegal deals. Clearly this means we all need to vote for Biden

[Sour Masher]

Right, its so not like Trump to make illegal deals. Clearly this means we all need to vote for Biden

I will be voting for him over Trump. That seems to be the choice now.

[The Feral Slasher]

I type poorly on my phone. I edited for clarity. See my previous post. I do disagree, somewhat. You cannot point to or blame, imo, Biden's win all on endorsements and establishment support. We all knew he would always have that. Many of us thought it would not he enough to overcome Bernie. I think something else is in play. If enough voters were true believers in Bernie, this surge to Biden would not have happened, endorsements or not. It seems to me many voters had weak commitments and were easily swayed to Biden. It must have been in them to flee to perceived safety. It was not in GOP voters in 2016. They went with the anti-establishment candidate despite just as big an effort to stop him from within that party.

Biden is a really poor candidate. But he is likely our candidate now. I wont bother with anuthing else

[The Feral Slasher]

I will be voting for him over Trump. That seems to be the choice now.

Completely beside the point. But carry on

[Sour Masher]

Biden is a really poor candidate. But he is likely our candidate now. I wont bother with anuthing else

You seem pissed, and you seem to think this is all the fault of the DNC wanting Biden over Bernie. Of course they did. That was never a secret at all. If any of us thought that fact was insurmountable, then why bother fighting the will of the party elders to begin with? Obviously, many thought it could be overcome, especially in the wake of how Trump overcame the will of the GOP in 2016--I was won of them. I thought Bernie had this.

If you want to be mad, be mad at the voters. The establishment of the party may have told them who to support, but they were the ones that listened. They did not have to, and we all knew this was coming, and progressives thought despite this, Bernie could win. I thought he could win the nomination. I thought he would win the nomination. And he could have, had voters backed him enough. Many ended up bailing. Their support was weak to be flipped so easily.

[Sour Masher]

I'm not mad at the establishment doing what we all knew they would always do. I am disappointed in the voters who had many choices and ended up going with old reliable that I fear isn't all that reliable anymore, and even if he were, doesn't have an agenda that is going to move the needle in a meaningful way on issues of health care and the environment like I had hoped.

Disappointing, but again, that is the on the voters. The DNC and the centrist powers in the party did what was perfectly reasonable for them to do in this situation. Their support and influence did not make this outcome inevitable, though.

[The Feral Slasher]

You seem pissed, and you seem to think this is all the fault of the DNC wanting Biden over Bernie. Of course they did. That was never a secret at all. If any of us thought that fact was insurmountable, then why bother fighting the will of the party elders to begin with?.

Come on dude. You know Trump will win, why bother fighting.

[Teenwolf]

Almost all the other candidates endorsed him, shouldn't be too surprising he's getting a huge boost. It's unfortunate for us progressives but Biden is ready for the fight. I think he held back in the primary because he understood the real fight hadn't yet begun.

Almost as if spending his entire last debate fighting the refs on time instead of saying anything of substance was a cover for the fact that he can't form a complete sentence. Should work great against Trump.

He's been holding back on his ability to form complete sentences until now, just waiting for the right time to bring it out... man, I know you want to be optimistic, but if it actually goes to Biden, the general will be a trainwreck. I can't even fathom how depressing the race will be.

It seems (at this very early point, for super Tuesday at least) Bernie couldn't overcome the media hatred, establishment hatred, the Warren "progressive" vote split, and Obama interference were all enough to overcome Bernie's actual grassroots rallies of 15K to 30K rallies in favor of Biden's senior centers that had zero enthusiasm... seems Democratic voters follow their leadership instructions more firmly than the Republican voters did for Trump.

Still, if Bernie takes Texas and California, depending on margins, he could still have a shot to overtake, especially given Biden's upcoming debate where he will need to speak for up to 45 mins. That will not go well, even if the media have been claiming it's over.

Plus, if Warren gets knocked out tonight, that could re-shape support for Bernie. The problem is that California could take weeks to verify the final tally, and that will hurt the narrative of Biden's delegate lead until California verifies its results.

[Sour Masher]

Till tonight, I actually had not realized how much I had come around on Bernie as the nominee. I am surprised by how disappointed I am in this outcome, especially thinking about health care and environmental policy in the country. I will get over it soon and support Biden, who I think is a much more decent and good person than Trump, and has much better policies. But yeah, I'm pretty freaking bummed. More so than I thought I would be as someone who isn't as far to the left as Bernie economically. I guess I'm a lot closer to him than to Biden right now. I really thought Bernie had this.

[Sour Masher]

It seems (at this very early point, for super Tuesday at least) Bernie couldn't overcome the media hatred, establishment hatred, the Warren "progressive" vote split, and Obama interference were all enough to overcome Bernie's actual grassroots rallies of 15K to 30K rallies in favor of Biden's senior centers that had zero enthusiasm... seems Democratic voters follow their leadership instructions more firmly than the Republican voters did for Trump.

As I just posted, I am surprised at how disappointed I am by this outcome. Maybe being on this forum and reading your posts, and FS, and GITH skewed my idea of how strong and universal Bernie's support was. I really thought he had this thing. I knew he had all that against him. You knew it too. But you still believed. And now we know it isn't true. I am not 100% aligned with Bernie, but I had really come around on the idea that he would be the best person to pull in the direction I hope this country will go, especially on health care and the environment. And I like Biden perfectly fine. Would love to hang out with him. But to realize he is the guy that will be fighting that fight as POTUS. Wow, I'm super deflated right now. The best we can hope for is a reversal of the most damaging things Trump has done, and maybe some small steps beyond that. Not nearly as much as I was beginning to hope for.

[Sour Masher]

Come on dude. You know Trump will win, why bother fighting.

I do not know that. I think/hope Biden can beat him. But then again, I thought Sanders could win the nomination, despite the odds. So I don't know much, it seems.