Election 2020

[In the Corn]

Thoughts on Bernie suggesting Fidel Castro did good with his literacy program?

Why would he give this kind of fodder to other campaigns? Horrible blunder. Stop praising dictators. (on the other hand, it's worked for Trump, so who knows?)

[Teenwolf]

Thoughts on Bernie suggesting Fidel Castro did good with his literacy program?

Why would he give this kind of fodder to other campaigns? Horrible blunder. Stop praising dictators. (on the other hand, it's worked for Trump, so who knows?)

I think it makes Bernie seem nuanced and intelligent.

It actually looks similar to Obama's praise of Castro, but Bernie doesn't go as far. How does that make you feel?

[B-Fly]

Thoughts on Bernie suggesting Fidel Castro did good with his literacy program?

Why would he give this kind of fodder to other campaigns? Horrible blunder. Stop praising dictators. (on the other hand, it's worked for Trump, so who knows?)

I don't think praising the literacy initiative while more broadly condemning the authoritarian Castro regime is that big a deal, no.

[Sour Masher]

I don't think praising the literacy initiative while more broadly condemning the authoritarian Castro regime is that big a deal, no.

As my other recent posts attempting to show how we should judge everyone in a full context, and my general frustration when people are taken out of context, I agree, in principle. In practice, given the way our news media works, with snippets, sound bites, and misleading headlines, praising anything Castro did, even if it warrants it, is a political misstep. It should not be a big deal, but he has opened the door for is opponents to try to make it one.

ETA: Will it be a misstep that actually hurts him in a meaningful way? No. But he should start being careful about stuff like this. He needs to recognize that associating him with people like Castro is going to be the major strategy used against him.

[Teenwolf]

As my other recent posts attempting to show how we should judge everyone in a full context, and my general frustration when people are taken out of context, I agree, in principle. In practice, given the way our news media works, with snippets, sound bites, and misleading headlines, praising anything Castro did, even if it warrants it, is a political misstep. It should not be a big deal, but he has opened the door for is opponents to try to make it one.

ETA: Will it be a misstep that actually hurts him in a meaningful way? No. But he should start being careful about stuff like this. He needs to recognize that associating him with people like Castro is going to be the major strategy used against him.

I would posit that these attacks make the media look silly. Just like media attacks on Trump's lack of decorum in the 2016 primary, these disingenuous attacks will only power Bernie with a certain segment who loathe the media. I don't think trust in the media is particularly high.

[Sour Masher]

I would posit that these attacks make the media look silly. Just like media attacks on Trump's lack of decorum in the 2016 primary, these disingenuous attacks will only power Bernie with a certain segment who loathe the media. I don't think trust in the media is particularly high.

You may be right. I would still be careful if I were him. I do think he needs to court the middle to win, and he needs to quiet any fears about him with the centrist voters I think he will need to beat Trump, especially in key states. I take heart in the fact that despite his reputation for being unwavering in all progressive ideals, he picked his battles to win in Vermont, taking a very moderate view on gun control. It shows he knows how to court the middle when needed.

[Teenwolf]

You may be right. I would still be careful if I were him. I do think he needs to court the middle to win, and he needs to quiet any fears about him with the centrist voters I think he will need to beat Trump, especially in key states. I take heart in the fact that despite his reputation for being unwavering in all progressive ideals, he picked his battles to win in Vermont, taking a very moderate view on gun control. It shows he knows how to court the middle when needed.

Well, he didn't go as far as Obama did in praising their health care system, access to care, and increased lifespan to equal that of the US. That would have been a misstep.

[Sour Masher]

Well, he didn't go as far as Obama did in praising their health care system, access to care, and increased lifespan to equal that of the US. That would have been a misstep.

Obama made many missteps, but not enough to undermine the general ethos he established for himself. I think of how many things would have sunk a less charismatic candidate. Reverend Wright alone could have done it. Obama overcame many missteps, but others have been done in over absurdly small things. A yell did in Howard Dean, as absurd as that seems now (maybe not, but it did seem to switch the narrative on him). Public opinion can be a very fragile thing. You have to be careful. His base will never waver, but some will, on the smallest of details.

[Teenwolf]

Obama made many missteps, but not enough to undermine the general ethos he established for himself. I think of how many things would have sunk a less charismatic candidate. Reverend Wright alone could have done it. Obama overcame many missteps, but others have been done in over absurdly small things. A yell did in Howard Dean, as absurd as that seems now (maybe not, but it did seem to switch the narrative on him). Public opinion can be a very fragile thing. You have to be careful. His base will never waver, but some will, on the smallest of details.

I really think his appeal is his honesty. If he were to pander by making concessions, people would be less attracted to his message. Like with the terrorists voting issue. He sees pandering as more damaging than being honest, even if the truth isn't exactly what people want to hear.

But I do believe he has the ability to moderate his messaging, and I think he will in the general.

[Sour Masher]

I really think his appeal is his honesty. If he were to pander by making concessions, people would be less attracted to his message. Like with the terrorists voting issue. He sees pandering as more damaging than being honest, even if the truth isn't exactly what people want to hear.

But I do believe he has the ability to moderate his messaging, and I think he will in the general.

Yeah, those are two different things. I'm not suggesting he change his core ideals, but some of his language and pick his battles. He did that in Nevada when he emphasized "I am not a socialist or a plutocrat, I am a DEMOCRAT, and proud of it." I think he did that on gun control. I think in the abstract, he would want tougher laws, but it wasn't really a major issue in Vermont. Their crime rates are low, so why pick it as a battle, when doing so could make him lose and with his loss, there is a loss on issues he cares about more. He will have to do that, play up the things like that. He will scare more on taxes than Obama, but less on the 2nd amendment. He needs to highlight those things he is more moderate on, to minimize FUD against him.

[TS Garp]

Yeah, those are two different things. I'm not suggesting he change his core ideals, but some of his language and pick his battles. He did that in Nevada when he emphasized "I am not a socialist or a plutocrat, I am a DEMOCRAT, and proud of it." I think he did that on gun control. I think in the abstract, he would want tougher laws, but it wasn't really a major issue in Vermont. Their crime rates are low, so why pick it as a battle, when doing so could make him lose and with his loss, there is a loss on issues he cares about more. He will have to do that, play up the things like that. He will scare more on taxes than Obama, but less on the 2nd amendment. He needs to highlight those things he is more moderate on, to minimize FUD against him.

There was a good episode of Pod Save America where they talked about how Sanders needs to really consider his messaging in the general election, and focus more on -- for example -- fulfilling the promise that FDR started as opposed to getting too theoretical or saying things which (fairly or not) will push people's buttons who are on the fence about him. I was talking to someone about the election who isn't generally political. She told me that she likes Sanders a lot but that her friends are giving her a hard time and calling her a "commie." Might sound crazy to you and me but this is very much what he's going to be up against in the general.

[Sour Masher]

There was a good episode of Pod Save America where they talked about how Sanders needs to really consider his messaging in the general election, and focus more on -- for example -- fulfilling the promise that FDR started as opposed to getting too theoretical or saying things which (fairly or not) will push people's buttons who are on the fence about him. I was talking to someone about the election who isn't generally political. She told me that she likes Sanders a lot but that her friends are giving her a hard time and calling her a "commie." Might sound crazy to you and me but this is very much what he's going to be up against in the general.

Yeah, I get the same kind of feedback from some--he is going to have to push back on the "commie" image. I think some in his base don't realize the need to reach out to those folks in language that will invite them into the tent, but they need is there. He has shown signs he gets it too, and I think he will. The FDR angle is dead on, I agree.

[The Feral Slasher]

There was a good episode of Pod Save America where they talked about how Sanders needs to really consider his messaging in the general election, and focus more on -- for example -- fulfilling the promise that FDR started as opposed to getting too theoretical or saying things which (fairly or not) will push people's buttons who are on the fence about him. I was talking to someone about the election who isn't generally political. She told me that she likes Sanders a lot but that her friends are giving her a hard time and calling her a "commie." Might sound crazy to you and me but this is very much what he's going to be up against in the general.

It would probably work better to compare himself to FDR than European Democratic Socialists. Doesn't seem so un-American.

[Sour Masher]

It would probably work better to compare himself to FDR than European Democratic Socialists. Doesn't seem so un-American.

I suspect you are being a little tongue-in-cheek here, but you are right .

[The Feral Slasher]

I suspect you are being a little tongue-in-cheek here, but you are right .

I wasn't at all. I really do believe it is about marketing and Americans are nothing if not patriotic which should be considered. Okay, maybe I was