Election 2020

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  • nots
    Journeyman
    • Jan 2011
    • 2907

    Originally posted by DMT
    Nor is Kamala Harris'.
    I don’t know about that....California has a very early primary this year, followed by several Southern ones, where Democratic minorities would likely do well. A decent showing in Iowa, followed by a dead cat bounce by Warren in NH, followed by Harris winning in SC and California and she would have a lot of momentum.

    Comment

    • nots
      Journeyman
      • Jan 2011
      • 2907

      Originally posted by B-Fly
      I'm not interested in and don't plan to engage in any pot shots against any prospective Democratic nominee. Welcome to the race. You've got a good year to sell me on why you should have my vote and my support.
      Ronald Reagan approves of this message.

      Comment

      • DMT
        MVP
        • Jan 2011
        • 12012

        Originally posted by revo
        Interesting. In this year of the woman in politics, why do you say that (moreso about Harris).
        Her prosecutorial record isn't very progressive.
        If DMT didn't exist we would have to invent it. There has to be a weirdest thing. Once we have the concept weird, there has to be a weirdest thing. And DMT is simply it.
        - Terence McKenna

        Bullshit is everywhere. - George Carlin (& Jon Stewart)

        How old would you be if you didn't know how old you are? - Satchel Paige

        Comment

        • baldgriff
          All Star
          • Jan 2011
          • 7479

          A platform not built on "Anything is better than Trump" is an important starting point. Defining exactly what you are for or against is going to be important. The problem with doing that is it inevitably disenfranchises various voting blocks on the left side. If you disenfranchise one - you tend to disenfranchise a number of them. The other concern in my mind on the D side is that we are seeing the effects of the pendulum that has been swinging further and further left in that party. Will that pendulum continue moving left - which may likely create some serious concerns with more moderate lefties - or will it start swinging back to the middle.

          Having a defined platform that unites the left - would be easy - "Im not Trump". Selling that in the general election to the masses - likely not as easy.
          It is wrong and ultimately self-defeating for a nation of immigrants to permit the kind of abuse of our immigration laws we have seen in recent years and we must stop it.
          Bill Clinton 1995, State of the Union Address


          "When they go low - we go High" great motto - too bad it was a sack of bullshit. DNC election mantra

          Comment

          • DMT
            MVP
            • Jan 2011
            • 12012

            Originally posted by B-Fly
            I'm not interested in and don't plan to engage in any pot shots against any prospective Democratic nominee. Welcome to the race. You've got a good year to sell me on why you should have my vote and my support.
            I haven't made up my mind either, but examining someone's record is not a pot shot.
            If DMT didn't exist we would have to invent it. There has to be a weirdest thing. Once we have the concept weird, there has to be a weirdest thing. And DMT is simply it.
            - Terence McKenna

            Bullshit is everywhere. - George Carlin (& Jon Stewart)

            How old would you be if you didn't know how old you are? - Satchel Paige

            Comment

            • DMT
              MVP
              • Jan 2011
              • 12012

              Originally posted by baldgriff
              A platform not built on "Anything is better than Trump" is an important starting point. Defining exactly what you are for or against is going to be important. The problem with doing that is it inevitably disenfranchises various voting blocks on the left side. If you disenfranchise one - you tend to disenfranchise a number of them. The other concern in my mind on the D side is that we are seeing the effects of the pendulum that has been swinging further and further left in that party. Will that pendulum continue moving left - which may likely create some serious concerns with more moderate lefties - or will it start swinging back to the middle.

              Having a defined platform that unites the left - would be easy - "Im not Trump". Selling that in the general election to the masses - likely not as easy.
              Trump fooled the country once, he won't be able to do it again. (Other than his delusional base). He's a weak candidate who is further going to be hurt by his own primary challengers.
              If DMT didn't exist we would have to invent it. There has to be a weirdest thing. Once we have the concept weird, there has to be a weirdest thing. And DMT is simply it.
              - Terence McKenna

              Bullshit is everywhere. - George Carlin (& Jon Stewart)

              How old would you be if you didn't know how old you are? - Satchel Paige

              Comment

              • baldgriff
                All Star
                • Jan 2011
                • 7479

                Originally posted by DMT
                Trump fooled the country once, he won't be able to do it again. (Other than his delusional base). He's a weak candidate who is further going to be hurt by his own primary challengers.
                Im no fan of Trump. That said, the Right does not have as big a problem defining their position - it may be figuring out how to get back to the center a bit and finding a way to hamstring Trump using his own words against him. You may not like either of these guys, but I think if Ted Cruz or Mitt Romney were willing to get their pants a bit dirty and start calling out Trump for some of his exploits - they may be able to pick up some steam by showing they can be much more diplomatic and still throw a good punch.
                It is wrong and ultimately self-defeating for a nation of immigrants to permit the kind of abuse of our immigration laws we have seen in recent years and we must stop it.
                Bill Clinton 1995, State of the Union Address


                "When they go low - we go High" great motto - too bad it was a sack of bullshit. DNC election mantra

                Comment

                • nots
                  Journeyman
                  • Jan 2011
                  • 2907

                  Originally posted by baldgriff
                  Im no fan of Trump. That said, the Right does not have as big a problem defining their position - it may be figuring out how to get back to the center a bit and finding a way to hamstring Trump using his own words against him. You may not like either of these guys, but I think if Ted Cruz or Mitt Romney were willing to get their pants a bit dirty and start calling out Trump for some of his exploits - they may be able to pick up some steam by showing they can be much more diplomatic and still throw a good punch.
                  Without something substantive from Mueller (or a new scandal) running against Trump in the primaries is a Kamakazi mission. He has an 89% approval rating among Republicans. The folks taking him on are committing political suicide and will be forever ostracized within the party. Additionally, I can’t imagine any card carrying Republican wants ‘kept Trump from 2nd term’ to be the first line in their obituary. I realize it’s a liberal fantasy that some white knight is going to ride in and wound Trump in a primary but I just can’t see it happening. Maybe, maybe someone planning on switching parties (Flake?), but even then it seems more fantasy than reality.

                  Comment

                  • DMT
                    MVP
                    • Jan 2011
                    • 12012

                    Originally posted by nots
                    Without something substantive from Mueller (or a new scandal) running against Trump in the primaries is a Kamakazi mission. He has an 89% approval rating among Republicans. The folks taking him on are committing political suicide and will be forever ostracized within the party. Additionally, I can’t imagine any card carrying Republican wants ‘kept Trump from 2nd term’ to be the first line in their obituary. I realize it’s a liberal fantasy that some white knight is going to ride in and wound Trump in a primary but I just can’t see it happening. Maybe, maybe someone planning on switching parties (Flake?), but even then it seems more fantasy than reality.
                    Kasich 'actively thinking' lol.

                    Calling the current political climate "disturbing," outgoing Republican Ohio Gov. John Kasich told "Fox News Sunday" that he is "actively considering" mounting a primary challenge to President Trump in the 2020 election.
                    If DMT didn't exist we would have to invent it. There has to be a weirdest thing. Once we have the concept weird, there has to be a weirdest thing. And DMT is simply it.
                    - Terence McKenna

                    Bullshit is everywhere. - George Carlin (& Jon Stewart)

                    How old would you be if you didn't know how old you are? - Satchel Paige

                    Comment

                    • DMT
                      MVP
                      • Jan 2011
                      • 12012

                      Originally posted by baldgriff
                      Im no fan of Trump. That said, the Right does not have as big a problem defining their position - it may be figuring out how to get back to the center a bit and finding a way to hamstring Trump using his own words against him. You may not like either of these guys, but I think if Ted Cruz or Mitt Romney were willing to get their pants a bit dirty and start calling out Trump for some of his exploits - they may be able to pick up some steam by showing they can be much more diplomatic and still throw a good punch.
                      The Democrats had no problem defining their platform in the mid-terms.
                      If DMT didn't exist we would have to invent it. There has to be a weirdest thing. Once we have the concept weird, there has to be a weirdest thing. And DMT is simply it.
                      - Terence McKenna

                      Bullshit is everywhere. - George Carlin (& Jon Stewart)

                      How old would you be if you didn't know how old you are? - Satchel Paige

                      Comment

                      • baldgriff
                        All Star
                        • Jan 2011
                        • 7479

                        Originally posted by nots
                        Without something substantive from Mueller (or a new scandal) running against Trump in the primaries is a Kamakazi mission. He has an 89% approval rating among Republicans. The folks taking him on are committing political suicide and will be forever ostracized within the party. Additionally, I can’t imagine any card carrying Republican wants ‘kept Trump from 2nd term’ to be the first line in their obituary. I realize it’s a liberal fantasy that some white knight is going to ride in and wound Trump in a primary but I just can’t see it happening. Maybe, maybe someone planning on switching parties (Flake?), but even then it seems more fantasy than reality.
                        You may be right nots!

                        Im just getting very tired of both sides willing to play a game of scorched earth politics - even though it continues to make my point that the parties are more concerned about themselves than the actual people.

                        At some point someone is going to have to be a uniter here.
                        It is wrong and ultimately self-defeating for a nation of immigrants to permit the kind of abuse of our immigration laws we have seen in recent years and we must stop it.
                        Bill Clinton 1995, State of the Union Address


                        "When they go low - we go High" great motto - too bad it was a sack of bullshit. DNC election mantra

                        Comment

                        • DMT
                          MVP
                          • Jan 2011
                          • 12012

                          Originally posted by baldgriff
                          You may be right nots!

                          Im just getting very tired of both sides willing to play a game of scorched earth politics - even though it continues to make my point that the parties are more concerned about themselves than the actual people.

                          At some point someone is going to have to be a uniter here.
                          And the country is tired of our president governing like a toddler. Clear majorities a) are opposed to the wall, and b) blame Trump and McConnell for the shutdown.

                          The Democrats have absolutely no incentive to placate the toddler.
                          If DMT didn't exist we would have to invent it. There has to be a weirdest thing. Once we have the concept weird, there has to be a weirdest thing. And DMT is simply it.
                          - Terence McKenna

                          Bullshit is everywhere. - George Carlin (& Jon Stewart)

                          How old would you be if you didn't know how old you are? - Satchel Paige

                          Comment

                          • revo
                            Administrator
                            • Jan 2011
                            • 26128

                            Originally posted by nots
                            Without something substantive from Mueller (or a new scandal) running against Trump in the primaries is a Kamakazi mission. He has an 89% approval rating among Republicans. The folks taking him on are committing political suicide and will be forever ostracized within the party. Additionally, I can’t imagine any card carrying Republican wants ‘kept Trump from 2nd term’ to be the first line in their obituary. I realize it’s a liberal fantasy that some white knight is going to ride in and wound Trump in a primary but I just can’t see it happening. Maybe, maybe someone planning on switching parties (Flake?), but even then it seems more fantasy than reality.
                            Running a primary campaign against the incumbent didn't seem to affect the futures of Ronald Reagan or Ted Kennedy, even after the incumbent lost.


                            Also, a PBS/Marist poll released today shows that 57% of registered voters will absolutely not vote for Trump in '20. But more importantly, the % of Republicans who said they definitely would vote for Trump has dropped to just 69%.

                            Comment

                            • nots
                              Journeyman
                              • Jan 2011
                              • 2907

                              Originally posted by DMT
                              And the country is tired of our president governing like a toddler. Clear majorities a) are opposed to the wall, and b) blame Trump and McConnell for the shutdown.

                              The Democrats have absolutely no incentive to placate the toddler.
                              I don’t disagree with your toddler comment, but I think you have to be careful with the clear majorities stuff.
                              Clear majorities were against Obamacare too. We don’t govern based on clear majorities.

                              Comment

                              • nots
                                Journeyman
                                • Jan 2011
                                • 2907

                                Originally posted by revo
                                Running a primary campaign against the incumbent didn't seem to affect the futures of Ronald Reagan or Ted Kennedy, even after the incumbent lost.


                                Also, a PBS/Marist poll released today shows that 57% of registered voters will absolutely not vote for Trump in '20. But more importantly, the % of Republicans who said they definitely would vote for Trump has dropped to just 69%.
                                https://thehill.com/homenews/campaig...-trump-in-2020
                                I don’t believe Ford had an 89% rating amongst Republicans and I am sure Carter didn’t have one amongst Democrats. If the % sinks, sure it’s possible, but if it stays where it is, I can’t see it. Plus, America has become much, much more tribal since the 70s. ‘My team is the best and your team sucks’ wasn’t as prevelant back then

                                Comment

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