Originally posted by Hornsby
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Far Right Extremists
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If DMT didn't exist we would have to invent it. There has to be a weirdest thing. Once we have the concept weird, there has to be a weirdest thing. And DMT is simply it.
- Terence McKenna
Bullshit is everywhere. - George Carlin (& Jon Stewart)
How old would you be if you didn't know how old you are? - Satchel Paige
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You start by accusing your debate partner with terrorism. Why do you expect rational discourse?
JAd Astra per Aspera
Oh. In that case, never mind. - Wonderboy
GITH fails logic 101. - bryanbutler
Bah...OJH caught me. - Pogues
I don't know if you guys are being willfully ignorant, but... - Judge Jude
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Originally posted by onejayhawk View PostYou start by accusing your debate partner with terrorism. Why do you expect rational discourse?
J
You're welcome to provide any link that support your position. Until you're able to do that, quit whining!Larry David was once being heckled, long before any success. Heckler says "I'm taking my dog over to fuck your mother, weekly." Larry responds "I hate to tell you this, but your dog isn't liking it."
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Originally posted by Judge Jude View PostI would be interested in B-Fly's response to whether the Anti-Defamation League is the Holy Bible (so to speak) of objectivity on the issue.
I don't necessarily disagree with your premise, but in general I also think you are trying to figure out how to best get your points across. if the ADL is a group whose pros and cons you have studied, at all, and you have concluded that they are a very reliable source, that's fine - because then if they publish another report that goes against your preconceptions, you presumably would defer to them (maybe even post it here).
but if such a report would lead you to dismiss them, then you would just be someone who has an ax to grind and is looking around randomly for an ax-grinder.
do you like to be surprised by articles that are counter to those preconceptions? those are the best kind, seriously. it's great to feel as if you understand something, only to find that new knowledge can persuade you otherwise.
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Originally posted by Judge Jude View PostI would be interested in B-Fly's response to whether the Anti-Defamation League is the Holy Bible (so to speak) of objectivity on the issue.
I don't necessarily disagree with your premise, but in general I also think you are trying to figure out how to best get your points across. if the ADL is a group whose pros and cons you have studied, at all, and you have concluded that they are a very reliable source, that's fine - because then if they publish another report that goes against your preconceptions, you presumably would defer to them (maybe even post it here).
but if such a report would lead you to dismiss them, then you would just be someone who has an ax to grind and is looking around randomly for an ax-grinder.
do you like to be surprised by articles that are counter to those preconceptions? those are the best kind, seriously. it's great to feel as if you understand something, only to find that new knowledge can persuade you otherwise.
White Nationalism is clearly a more widespread threat to a greater number of Americans than Muslim extremism, yet the right wing has decided to protect the extremists as the Southern Strategy 2.0. They prefer the easy votes to be mined through traditional fear mongering of all "others". Mexicans, Muslims, "Globalists" (Jews), transgender people, "angry mobs"... it's all Scare Tactics 101. Some of the extreme from your camp become radicalized and murder in the name of supporting their concept of "the Right". The fact is, nobody from the left embraced or supported left wing terrorism in the Steve Scalise case, they universally denounced it. Yet the Right wing are too fucking morally compromised to abandon those "deplorable" votes... they'd rather give comfort in times of attacks from the left, such as Trump calling out the "Globalists" to chants of ""Soros! Soros! Soros!" and Trump chuckles... on the same day of the synagogue massacre, and less than a week after Soros had a bomb sent to him. All from a script, it's clearly intentional!Larry David was once being heckled, long before any success. Heckler says "I'm taking my dog over to fuck your mother, weekly." Larry responds "I hate to tell you this, but your dog isn't liking it."
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Originally posted by Teenwolf View PostI have a very low bar set up for you, not sure how you keep ramming into it.
You're welcome to provide any link that support your position. Until you're able to do that, quit whining!
Originally posted by Teenwolf View PostBuckle up for hearing the name Steve Scalise a million times in the wake of the right wing extremist attacks, both with the mail bomber and the synagogue shooter.
The reality is that right-wing extremists commit acts of violence with far more frequency than any left wing counterparts (Antifa only show up to fascist congregations, and they're only a threat to fascist sympathizers). Take a look at these statistics from a study published by the Anti-Defamation League:
Do the math. Less than 3% of the extremist murders were by left-wing extremists. It's an interesting article. Keep it in mind as the media debates the "violent rhetoric and actions on both sides" this week. Fox News literally interrupted coverage of McConnell's upsetting dinner experience to deliver breaking news about the bombs... without a hint of shame or irony. "Both sides", everyone!
https://www.adl.org/resources/report...states-in-2016
JAd Astra per Aspera
Oh. In that case, never mind. - Wonderboy
GITH fails logic 101. - bryanbutler
Bah...OJH caught me. - Pogues
I don't know if you guys are being willfully ignorant, but... - Judge Jude
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Originally posted by onejayhawk View PostThatis easy enough. After all, you said it.
I love the way you make antifa violence acceptable. Kudos on that. It's straight of the SA handbook.
JLast edited by Teenwolf; 10-29-2018, 09:46 AM.Larry David was once being heckled, long before any success. Heckler says "I'm taking my dog over to fuck your mother, weekly." Larry responds "I hate to tell you this, but your dog isn't liking it."
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thanks for your response, B-Fly.
from last week's Time magazine (I think it's paywalled):
"Civility is a style of argument that implicitly welcomes response. It is a display or respect and tolerance, which makes clear that you are engaging in a conversation, not delivering the last word. Unlike contempt, which generally seems less about your targets than about creating an ugly spectacle for your own partisans to enjoy, a civil argument is a plea to all fellow citizens to respond, even if in opposition. It invites the broader body of concerned citizens to fill in the gaps of my knowledge, to correct the flaws in my argument and to continue to deliberate in a rapidly changing world." - Phil Klayfinished 10th in this 37th yr in 11-team-only NL 5x5
own picks 1, 2, 5, 6, 9 in April 2022 1st-rd farmhand draft
won in 2017 15 07 05 04 02 93 90 84
SP SGray 16, TWalker 10, AWood 10, Price 3, KH Kim 2, Corbin 10
RP Bednar 10, Bender 10, Graterol 2
C Stallings 2, Casali 1
1B Votto 10, 3B ERios 2, 1B Zimmerman 2, 2S Chisholm 5, 2B Hoerner 5, 2B Solano 2, 2B LGarcia 10, SS Gregorius 17
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Originally posted by Judge Jude View Postthanks for your response, B-Fly.
from last week's Time magazine (I think it's paywalled):
"Civility is a style of argument that implicitly welcomes response. It is a display or respect and tolerance, which makes clear that you are engaging in a conversation, not delivering the last word. Unlike contempt, which generally seems less about your targets than about creating an ugly spectacle for your own partisans to enjoy, a civil argument is a plea to all fellow citizens to respond, even if in opposition. It invites the broader body of concerned citizens to fill in the gaps of my knowledge, to correct the flaws in my argument and to continue to deliberate in a rapidly changing world." - Phil KlayLarry David was once being heckled, long before any success. Heckler says "I'm taking my dog over to fuck your mother, weekly." Larry responds "I hate to tell you this, but your dog isn't liking it."
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Originally posted by Judge Jude View Postthanks for your response, B-Fly.
from last week's Time magazine (I think it's paywalled):
"Civility is a style of argument that implicitly welcomes response. It is a display or respect and tolerance, which makes clear that you are engaging in a conversation, not delivering the last word. Unlike contempt, which generally seems less about your targets than about creating an ugly spectacle for your own partisans to enjoy, a civil argument is a plea to all fellow citizens to respond, even if in opposition. It invites the broader body of concerned citizens to fill in the gaps of my knowledge, to correct the flaws in my argument and to continue to deliberate in a rapidly changing world." - Phil Klay
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Originally posted by Art Vandelay View PostI seldom venture into this forum but the title interested me.
I am curious teenwolf, do you support antifa and their ways?
and as an outsider looking in, you sound angry.
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Originally posted by B-Fly View PostAnd 95% of the time, I will select civility as my go-to style of argument. I do, however, think that there is sometimes a value in widespread societal contempt that makes no acceptable place for certain ideologies/behaviors/actions. For example, I'm sure there are still many Americans who believe that blacks and whites should never intermarry and would be happy to see the state still in the business of enforcing anti-miscegentation laws. However, any politician who proposed reinstituting anti-miscegenation laws or expressed an anti-miscegentation viewpoint would draw so much societal contempt that we don't have politicians (or at least any credible ones) expressing anti-miscegentation positions. That's an example where contempt, rather than civility, can be a net positive for our society.
This very thread is an example. Teenwolf may find his tactics successful in quieting down some posters, but does he move the needle one bit left? Nope.
You on the other hand selecting civility have actually made a few people see things differently and even changed a few minds on some topics.
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Originally posted by Gregg View PostI agree with this whole statement. My concern/question is when this is used are we really instigating change or just making it unacceptable to discuss?
This very thread is an example. Teenwolf may find his tactics successful in quieting down some posters, but does he move the needle one bit left? Nope.
You on the other hand selecting civility have actually made a few people see things differently and even changed a few minds on some topics.
I dont believe anybody here is changing minds.Larry David was once being heckled, long before any success. Heckler says "I'm taking my dog over to fuck your mother, weekly." Larry responds "I hate to tell you this, but your dog isn't liking it."
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