President Donald Trump

[baldgriff]

Old pics are still good pics!

[Sour Masher]

Yes. You voted for Trump and you breath air. That's all it takes.

Well, that is a start . But seriously, does the irony of folks like CBB actively insulting his opposition with terms like "snowflakes" and "butthurt" not amuse most of you, given that his pick for prez has to be the biggest "butthurt, snowflake" to ever walk the earth? Trump is constantly engaging any and all who insult him, even when their insults are true by distorting facts and using hashtags like "#unfair!!!!!!". This whiner is the guy you want to rally behind while calling others overly sensitive? It is almost as ironic and Trump and many of his supporters judging women on their size, when Trump himself should really be in the weight loss thread in this forum.

It is hard to take folks using such terms and deflecting from real debate by dismissing all opposition as the whining of butthurt, snowflake, losers as anything but trolls. Angering your opposition by calling them out for acting exactly how you and your side are acting is trolling 101. Not addressing a single direct point of criticism for the guy you are backing, but instead continuing to hold up the political corpse of HRC saying, "your girl lost, loser, and she was worse, and anyway lets talk about crowd sizes instead of medical coverage, and deflect, deflect, deflect..." is a great way to engage in meaningful dialogue as well.

Moving on from that, anyone want to defend Trump's tax plan, which will add trillions to our debt, and mostly just benefit the rich? His proposed cutting of exemptions and deductions ends up actually increasing the tax burden on many single parents and larger families, while his capital gains tax plan, doing away with the inheritance tax, and his reduced tax brackets mean massive benefits to the wealthy. One thing I used to agree with Republicans on is that we can't keep kicking the can down the road on our debt, but Trump has somehow not gotten a word of criticism from the right on his plans to increase our debt by trillions. This after years of criticizing Obama for doing the same.

[baldgriff]

Trump isnt a Republican

[DMT]

Trump isnt a Republican

Sorry, they own him now.

[Sour Masher]

Trump isnt a Republican

He ran and won as one, but I don't want to get sidetracked by more deflection. Does him not being a Republican exempt him from criticism for adding to our national debt? Obama isn't a Republican and it sure didn't seem to exempt him from criticism.

I'm looking for meaningful dialogue, with the slim but real hope that someone will use facts and logic to help me see how what I think will be a disastrous policy makes some kind of sense. I'd also like some clear differentiation helping me understand how Trump's additions to our debt are more justified that Obama's.

[baldgriff]

Glad I didnt vote for him...

[nots]

After the last 20 years, now suddenly the debt total is important?
Where was everyone 15 years ago when I was lamenting this? The horse is out of the barn now, but yes, his tax policy will further exasperate the situation for sure. To quote a famous politician, 'at this point, what difference does it make'?

[Sour Masher]

After the last 20 years, now suddenly the debt total is important?
Where was everyone 15 years ago when I was lamenting this? The horse is out of the barn now, but yes, his tax policy will further exasperate the situation for sure. To quote a famous politician, 'at this point, what difference does it make'?

I for one, have never been shy of addressing the debt issue, and being critical of both repubs and dems on ignoring it. I do think that if debt is a must, I'd rather go in debt helping the poor and building for our future rather than helping the rich and building our already obscenely large military. But I always have thought that was a false choice, and both sides pander to their base to make them ignore the ever-growing debt their promises and waste lead to.

In any event, you think the problem is now so big that we should no longer try to fix it, and we should no longer insist on our representatives trying to fix it? Will that be your position when the next Democrat POTUS thinks the same way and adds even more debt? Shouldn't the GOP fight Trump on these policies?

[nots]

I think it's so baked in right now that it doesn't matter who is President--there is no will by either party to fix it. THe GOP proudly went with the revenue neutral (lol) Medicare Part D and an Iraq war. The Dems followed up with continuing social programs that have had some rather dubious results (to be polite).
The CBO is projecting deficits to top $1T/yr again by the next decade (Heaven help whichever part wins in 2020 because they are going to get slaughtered in 2024). I guess my philosophy is that the situation is going to end catastrophically for the country at some point in the not too distant future. To me, it's no longer worth talking about until the day of reckoning arrives, regardless of who is in power, or who is wasting the money.

[Sour Masher]

To me, it's no longer worth talking about until the day of reckoning arrives, regardless of who is in power, or who is wasting the money.

Fair enough, but it seems a hell of a lot more important to me for us to talk about than inauguration crowd sizes.

I would like to find a topic that everyone IS invested in talking about rather than sideshow nonsense. How about education? The environment? Health care? Immigration policy? All of these issues matter to me, and Trump's rhetoric and appointment's related to these issues concern me greatly. Engaging in meaningful dialogue about any of these issues might enlighten me, or actually move some of our perspectives on these important issues.

[nots]

Fair enough, but it seems a hell of a lot more important to me for us to talk about than inauguration crowd sizes.

I would like to find a topic that everyone IS invested in talking about rather than sideshow nonsense. How about education? The environment? Health care? Immigration policy? All of these issues matter to me, and Trump's rhetoric and appointment's related to these issues concern me greatly.

If you believe the federal government is a major part of the problem, not the solution, then you wouldn't be upset about his picks. If you believe the federal government can be the conduit to a solution, then you should be upset. Comes down to philosophy IMO.

[cardboardbox]

Well, that is a start . But seriously, does the irony of folks like CBB actively insulting his opposition with terms like "snowflakes" and "butthurt" not amuse most of you, given that his pick for prez has to be the biggest "butthurt, snowflake" to ever walk the earth?

Have I been insulting someone? Not sure if snowflake is really that much of an insult, is it? Butthurt was tossed around a lot by the liberals here back in 2009, did you complain back then?

My vote was more against Clinton than for Trump.

[Pogues]

Well, it's a community thing here. He's not here for baseball and he has been antagonistic of late, so his presence seems rather self-serving.

I don't keep a complete ledger of who has and who hasn't, but the ones who haven't and aren't positive influences on the community do tend to stand out.

So long as we contribute, we can be a dick as much as we like. But if we're a dick and don't contribute, we will be publicly called out.

[Pogues]

He ran and won as one, but I don't want to get sidetracked by more deflection. Does him not being a Republican exempt him from criticism for adding to our national debt? Obama isn't a Republican and it sure didn't seem to exempt him from criticism.

I'm looking for meaningful dialogue, with the slim but real hope that someone will use facts and logic to help me see how what I think will be a disastrous policy makes some kind of sense. I'd also like some clear differentiation helping me understand how Trump's additions to our debt are more justified that Obama's.

Thing is, even not a lot of us non-Democrats (Republicans, Libertarians, Independents) on this site didn't vote for Trump and don't support him. Yeah, we might be happy Clinton didn't win, and many happy Obama is no longer in office, but we don't see Trump as a positive.

My belief is any addition to the National Debt is subject to extreme criticism, I don't care what party is responsible. Trump running up our national debt? What would you expect from someone who has declared bancruptcy (or his companies...same f'in thing) multiple times. He probably figures he can just declare US bankruptcy, and erase all the debts to foreign nations.

[Sour Masher]

Have I been insulting someone? Not sure if snowflake is really that much of an insult, is it? Butthurt was tossed around a lot by the liberals here back in 2009, did you complain back then?

My vote was more against Clinton than for Trump.

Fair enough on voting against HRC. At this point, I don't think it is productive to defend her or get into which was worse and why. I'm more interested in why a lot of folks here seem to be pretty chill about Trump and what he is doing, when I think in a lot of ways his policies will harm our country and most of us living in it.

I don't get the sense that lots here actively support him and all of his decisions, but then again, the GOP folks and Anti-HRC folks seem a lot more interested in baiting DEMs about more frivolous and ancillary issues than in engaging on real issues related to a Trump presidency.

Is it being a snowflake for me to be concerned about the impact of his policies on my disabled mother on SSD, or my sister who is a single mother of three who is likely to lose healthcare for herself and have her taxes increased? Or myself and my colleagues in education who may have our lives greatly impacted by decisions made by a women who doesn't even know about basic debates in education, or seem to understand the issues related to turning public education into a free-market system? How about we talk about any of these things in an honest, respectful way rather than continue to talk about the election at this point? Trump is POTUS now. It actually happened. And now we are seeing him make decisions that will impact our lives. We should care about and discuss that, I think.