Supreme Court of the United States

[Moonlight J]

Lol. Yeah, that’s the political part of it

If this wasn't any more than a farce, why would you leave out the one person that both the accused and the victim has identified as present?

[nots]

If this wasn't any more than a farce, why would you leave out the one person that both the accused and the victim has identified as present?

For the same reason you would sit on a sexual assault case for 6 weeks—politics. Cmon man, be better.

[Sour Masher]

Has anyone gotten to see any of Ford's testimony. I only have caught a bit of it, but she certainly seems credible and compelling to me. I'm wondering if anyone has been swayed by her today.

[baldgriff]

The parts I have seen have a person on each side of her trying to keep her story straight.

[In the Corn]

That's actually not true. I have blacked out twice, both in my early 20s when I'd have parties at my house (so no driving involved thankfully), and I distinctly remember the odd feeling the following morning that I did not remember how I got to bed. It's a very strange feeling and very memorable. Blacking out means you don't remember the time when you blacked out, but it also leaves a memorable impact when you realize the next morning that it occurred.

Correct, I should have said what you did.

[Sour Masher]

The parts I have seen have a person on each side of her trying to keep her story straight.

So you think she is lying? You don't find her testimony compelling evidence against Kavanaugh being appointed a SC justice?

[baldgriff]

So you think she is lying? You don't find her testimony compelling evidence against Kavanaugh being appointed a SC justice?

I have heard her say more than just once or twice that she doesnt recall - I cant remember - Im not sure - I'd like to provide more....

How can I make a decision one way or the other if she is telling the truth - if she cant provide some reasonable amount of information. My skepticism related to this claim is on the higher side. Sorry, but I am having a hard time with this - not because I am a Kavanaugh supporter - but rather that the level of political bullshit that is evident is brutally awful and divisive!

[Sour Masher]

I have heard her say more than just once or twice that she doesnt recall - I cant remember - Im not sure - I'd like to provide more....

How can I make a decision one way or the other if she is telling the truth - if she cant provide some reasonable amount of information. My skepticism related to this claim is on the higher side. Sorry, but I am having a hard time with this - not because I am a Kavanaugh supporter - but rather that the level of political bullshit that is evident is brutally awful and divisive!

You've said before you think this is a hit job, but the problem with that statement is that it requires believing Ford is part of a conspiracy to bring down Kavanaugh. I've conceded before that the Dems are playing politics with this issue, but I believe Ford's account of events to be credible, and she has been unequivocal that Kavanaugh assaulted her. Beyond that fact, if you believe it to be true, what else matters? The fact that others are coming out to corroborate that Kavanaugh has a pattern of poor behavior related to alcohol abuse just adds to my belief that there is more than enough reason here to move on to another qualified candidate. These folks have so much to lose by doing this and very little to gain personally. Ford has exposed herself by doing this in a way that very few would do. She has a good life, a good profession. She has more to lose than gain here.

ETA: You've said before that this could be both a political circus and a revelation of Kavanaugh's unfitness for holding a SC appointment. It seems, though, that the former reality is clouding your thought on the latter possibility. It also seems that your burden of proof on this is much higher than mine. Any reasonable doubts about a SC justice's fitness is enough for me to want to move on to the next person up for a lifetime appointment. This isn't a court of law. he isn't going to prison. He is being passed over in favor of other qualified candidates for the highest judicial position in our country. the bar for entry should be extremely high.

[baldgriff]

You've said before you think this is a hit job, but the problem with that statement is that it requires believing Ford is part of a conspiracy to bring down Kavanaugh. I've conceded before that the Dems are playing politics with this issue, but I believe Ford's account of events to be credible, and she has been unequivocal that Kavanaugh assaulted her. Beyond that fact, if you believe it to be true, what else matters? The fact that others are coming out to corroborate that Kavanaugh has a pattern of poor behavior related to alcohol abuse just adds to my belief that there is more than enough reason here to move on to another qualified candidate. These folks have so much to lose by doing this and very little to gain personally. Ford has exposed herself by doing this in a way that very few would do. She has a good life, a good profession. She has more to lose than gain here.

ETA: You've said before that this could be both a political circus and a revelation of Kavanaugh's unfitness for holding a SC appointment. It seems, though, that the former reality is clouding your thought on the latter possibility. It also seems that your burden of proof on this is much higher than mine. Any reasonable doubts about a SC justice's fitness is enough for me to want to move on to the next person up for a lifetime appointment. This isn't a court of law. he isn't going to prison. He is being passed over in favor of other qualified candidates for the highest judicial position in our country. the bar for entry should be extremely high.

I have stated previously that "it is possible" that something happened well over 30 years ago. With that said, whether she is complicit or not, her story and inability to provide more than some vague details about where or when it occurred and a consistent timeline cause me concern. So I have to weigh that against a guy who by all counts has an impressive record as a fair judge and applying the law in a reasonable manner.

One thing is "he said / she said" speculative vagueness and the other is a documented career as a judge with what appears to be any real documented blemishes in his time as a lawyer or judge.


I again will admit I understand that this is no court of law. You are saying that the bar should be set extremely high - yet here is guy that will have a hard time making any reasonable defense other than saying I didnt do what she said I did - because there are no witnesses, there is no real evidence, and the person making the accusation cant even tell her story in a consistent manner - and has blamed her therapist for getting the details wrong.

If the bar is to be held extremely high - there should be some evidence available to corroborate her claim. Something that he actually can defend himself against. He is being tried and hung in a court of public opinion, to hold a job where the courts wouldnt even hear the claim being made against him and why? There is not sufficient evidence. Its innuendos and inferences about things that happened. Seems pretty ironic.....

So is the bar being held really high or is it a game of limbo to see how low one can go?

[onejayhawk]

You've said before you think this is a hit job, but the problem with that statement is that it requires believing Ford is part of a conspiracy to bring down Kavanaugh. I've conceded before that the Dems are playing politics with this issue, but I believe Ford's account of events to be credible, and she has been unequivocal that Kavanaugh assaulted her. Beyond that fact, if you believe it to be true, what else matters? The fact that others are coming out to corroborate that Kavanaugh has a pattern of poor behavior related to alcohol abuse just adds to my belief that there is more than enough reason here to move on to another qualified candidate. These folks have so much to lose by doing this and very little to gain personally. Ford has exposed herself by doing this in a way that very few would do. She has a good life, a good profession. She has more to lose than gain here.

What part of that is difficult to believe? It is literally their standard procedure.

Several of her statements support the idea that she was encouraged to come forward. She is now certain of thigs that were cloudy before. Her high profile lawyer is pro bono (compare Manafort). She lives in one of the most politically active enclaves of California. The so called polygraph test was not properly monitored and recordings are not available. There is much to suggest an elaborate put-up job.

J

[gcstomp]

What has been cost to Ford? Had to move out of her home, death threats against her, considerable financial strains of needing security detail for who knows how long, for instance. Ford reached out prior to Kavanaughs nomination, when he was just another name on a list. She spoke with great conviction on the details that one could reasonably expect a trauma victim to remember, namely the attacker, and his buddy laughing at her, of her trying to scream out and Kavanaugh so roughly covering her face she feared she might be inadvertently killed.

She knows location was a 20 minute ride away, remembers bedroom, stairwell, her fight or flight response of when getting knocked off bed to ran for it. Ford asked for FBI investigation precisely to for instance, narrow details that could assist in this, in an hour the FBI could nail down when the friend, the other person in room with Kavanaugh, worked at Safeway, which Ford says would narrow down to the month when this took place.

The career prosecutor hired to question Ford, because its not a criminal court but lets question her that way, was asking lots of questions about filing paperwork and phonecall dates, that would require any person on this thread to shuffle through papers and have counsel chime in. Ford was a 1 in a 1000 witness, believable, bright, able to explain her motives, while not being an inch political or practiced. This wasnt someone spitting out "I just want a fair process" some 18 times in a 24 minute FOX interview. This was as good as good have been hoped for, while understanding there has been a cover up. There was another witness in room, who Ford clearly remembers locking eyes with during event, and he wasnt subpoened to appear? Of course this is a he said/she said, there has been a nearly unprecedented effort to suppress a true investigation here. Fords legal team desperately wanted to bring other witnesses, like the polygraph administrator, who could show full process, but again, no witnesses were allowed by this sham.

[Teenwolf]

You conspiracy theorists universally disgust me. Thanks to those willing to sling mud with these clowns on behalf of sanity, but I cant even with this level of delusional conspiratorial nonsense.

[baldgriff]

TW -
This guy has been vetted over and over and over again over the last 26 years for multiple positions within this government. Now just before a confirmation vote we get this accusation.

Her accusations have been refuted by the people she states were there. The details she provides are general at best.

He has his own documented calendars and diaries back that far to show where he was. He has more proof that he wasnt there, than she can provide that he was anywhere near a party.

TW - I am not trying to advocate any "conspiracy theory". I am stating that this is a political hit job.

[Ken]

This guy has been vetted over and over and over again over the last 26 years for multiple positions within this government. Now just before a confirmation vote we get this accusation.

Is that really surprising to you? He's suddenly all over the news and in the public spotlight after having been nominated by Trump for the supreme court and someone raises their hand. Seems reasonable to me that she would have been trying to forget it until now that he's all over the news.

The details she provides are general at best.

Huh? They were quite detailed actually.

He has his own documented calendars and diaries back that far to show where he was. He has more proof that he wasnt there, than she can provide that he was anywhere near a party.

Umm... that's not proof. Did you expect that he would have written "sexually assaulted someone at a party" on his calendar. What a joke.

TW - I am not trying to advocate any "conspiracy theory". I am stating that this is a political hit job.

Those would be the same thing... ?

[DMT]

BG can't help but show his true colors.