Is it possible to punt and still win

I'm in a 12 team AL & NL 6x6 league; draft is tomorrow night.

cats include:
HR, RBI, Runs, SB, Hits, OPS
W, S, K, ERA, WHIP, HOLD

From looking at the league settings it doesn't appear that there is a minimum innings pitched limit.

Is it possible to punt SB, W's, and K's and still have a chance to win the league?

I've participated in numerous 12 team standard 5x5 mock drafts, and found that I can easily finish 1st in the projected standings (using projected stats) by punting SB, W, and K. I start by loading up on power hitters with decent AVG's; then incorporate the top RP's who get lots of Saves and have the lowest WHIP and ERA.

I'm thinking it shouldn't be too difficult to replace the standard AVG cat players with good OPS players, and pick up HOLDS later in the draft and throughout the season.

I've heard that to win a roto league a team has to be well balanced; so should I dump the punt stunt?

[Judge Jude]

depends on:

- how much trading the league has and
- how deep the quality of the ownership is

by the latter, I mean that if few if any teams finish with a very poor point total, then your weakness in any one category is lessened. if a rival can rack up near max pts in most categories, even one poor category can kill you.

I once won back in the 4x4 days with no IP minimum; I opened with 5 closers (mostly cheap ones), gained enough SV by the All-Star break to clinch the category, then traded all 5 (some to strategic teams, meaning a team that could pass the top rival with one more closer. One closer I practically gave away; wasn't a keeper and was sure to cost the two other best teams a pt apiece).

tougher with 5x5, obviously. I only had SP to start the season, and in the 2nd half I went with all safe setup men to to ensure ERA and Ratio titles to go with my SV crown. and I beefed up the offense in all 5 closer deals, thereby winning most of those.

the trading angle I mentioned up top is that you want to move out all superfluous power, for instance you might be able to trade a couple of big boppers for big pt gains in SB (or even W/K), while losing little to no pts in HR/RBI.

and if you are dominating ERA/Ratio early, if making moves is easy, then you can start streaming in decent SPs to have a shot at passing a couple of teams in W/K. if they blow up, you have to turtle up again so you don't lose any ERA/Ratio pts. it's not an exact science, but it's more manageable than people think in unlimited or mostly unlimited streaming leagues.

[Moccasin]

Thanks Judge Jude... I wondered if this strategy is even ever considered by experts such as yourself and many posters at this site; I feel it's a bit risky to experiment with, and doing it could cost me a whole season to find out if punting so many categories while drafting, and still competing is possible. But I think I'll give it a try, and employ your advice during the season.

[Sharky]

Tougher with 5x5 than 4x4 as you've heard. And you're playing 6x6! It's possible to win I supoose, but punting multiple categories doesn't seem smart. Punting SB is one thing. Punting wins and Ks is probably ok too. Punting all three seems crazy to me. It's trying to capitalize on two scarcities. Seems inadvisable. Pick either one if you must.

[Judge Jude]

and keep in mind that "punting" has several definitions in this context.
if you mean not spending at the auction to acquire that category, ok.
but just because you don't buy an opening-day closer doesn't mean you should be trying to finish last in SV.
I never spend on closers at the auction, but virtually every year I freeze a closer-in-waiting or two who got promoted that season.

It's not uncommon for me to get 8 or 9 pts in SV without having bought an established closer that year.
does that mean I "punted" saves?

[Erik]

Punting one category in a 6x6 or 7x7 league is not a problem in my experience. I used to punt saves or steals in those all the time. The other categories are linked in some way to a much greater degree than those are, so you can load up on guys who help in those and forget about single-category guys.

Punting more than one category seems like a bad idea. Too many points to make up. You've gotta execute the other categories to perfection.

[revo]

The problem with projected stats is that they don't take into account "real life." Closer lose their jobs. Players get hurt. Did I mention that closers lose their jobs? Landing top closers will cost you either high draft picks or a lot of money (you didn't mention if it's a serp draft or auction), and they still have a high likelihood of losing their job. Holds vary wildly from year to year.

I think you can punt a category and be successful, but the more you punt, the more you need to be spot on with your other categories.

[Judge Jude]

it's easier to punt SV in 5x5, as one category of 10 and not 8.

but it's tougher to punt W in 5x5, as that also hurts you in Ks.

[DMT]

The short answer to your question is yes, but the plan you're considering would be nearly impossible to execute IMO.

[Judge Jude]

I won with a last place in W, as noted, in 4x4. we had other winners place last in SV or AVG as well.

again, part of that was the competitiveness of the league overall. if some owner wins 3 or 4 categories, then that 1 pt (or even if you scrape up 3 pts) is a killer.....

[Big Tymer]

Not in a competitive, keeper league imo. I'm only in deep 5x5s and even punting 1 category puts you in a deep hole when you consider the fact that contenders will be selling off future value to acquire present value such that all the top teams are semi-loaded. Redrafts might be a different story but I don't play in any and haven't in some time.

[willthethrill]

I don't think that you should ever plan to totally punt a category. You need to see where your bargains are and then adjust to what's happening. In our auction yesterday, one guy decided before the auction that he would punt saves. But, other than Aroldis and Kimbrel, closers went very cheap. His punting really didn't pay off and he had plenty of money to grab at least one cheap one. Instead, he's staring at one point in Saves without a decided edge anywhere else.

[Erik]

The anecdotal evidence I can provide from my (currently sole) league (5x5) is that the guy who almost always punts saves hasn't finished in the money since 2000.

However, he's extremely lazy and rarely ever trades or makes FAAB bids. Last year, the strategy worked as it should - he was first in W and K but last in S - and he finished fifth.

[Moccasin]

Here's how my draft went...

12 teams, 6x6, serp draft.

Cats:
HR, RBI, Runs, Hits, OPS, Steals
W, Saves, Holds, K's, ERA, WHIP


1. (4) Miguel Cabrera (Det - 1B,3B)
2. (21) Buster Posey (SF - C,1B)
3. (28) Justin Upton (SD - OF)
4. (45) Brian Dozier (Min - 2B)
5. (52) Matt Holliday (StL - OF)
6. (69) Mark Melancon (Pit - RP)
7. (76) Chris Davis (Bal - 1B,3B)
8. (93) Kris Bryant (ChC - 3B)
9. (100) Zach Britton (Bal - RP)
10. (117) Huston Street (LAA - RP)
11. (124) Tyler Clippard (Oak - RP)
12. (141) Brandon Moss (Cle - 1B,OF)
13. (148) Darren O'Day (Bal - RP)
14. (165) Jayson Werth (Was - OF)
15. (172) Michael Morse (Mia - 1B,OF)
16. (189) Joe Smith (LAA - RP)
17. (196) Adam LaRoche (CWS - 1B)
18. (213) Jordy Mercer (Pit - SS)
19. (220) Tanner Roark (Was - SP)
20. (237) Asdrubal Cabrera (TB - 2B,SS)
21. (244) Josh Collmenter (Ari - SP,RP)
22. (261) Kyle Lohse (Mil - SP)
23. (268) Kyle Hendricks (ChC - SP)
24. (285) Scooter Gennett (Mil - 2B)

Since the draft, I've dropped Tanner Roark and acquired Drew Pomeranz. There is no minimum innings pitched in this league, and my goal is to win ERA and WHIP, so I'm considering not even playing SP's. I acquired Drew Pomeranz just in case I feel I can pick up a few points in W's, but I haven't decided yet if I will play SP's. I drafted for HR's, RBI, Runs, Hits, OPS, Saves, Holds, ERA, and WHIP.

[Gregg]

Not in a competitive, keeper league imo. I'm only in deep 5x5s and even punting 1 category puts you in a deep hole when you consider the fact that contenders will be selling off future value to acquire present value such that all the top teams are semi-loaded. Redrafts might be a different story but I don't play in any and haven't in some time.

I have found this to be true.

I have never seen someone win a league 4x4 or 5x5 when punting a category.