Manny Ramirez Retires

[wilbur wood]

You know, I think that's a tough call, despite what now may be his 2nd infraction. Manny, like Bonds and ARod, were HOF talents before steroids. Guys like Palmeiro and McGwire likely became HOF talents because of steroids.

If I had a vote, I'd still vote for Manny for the Hall.

On what possible basis does Manny have a "before steroids" body of work? He has 2 positive tests, was purportedly on the secret 2003 list and came from a very juiced up Cleveland team. He was a known stoner throughout his career and was likey a hard core PED user throughout all of his peak power years. Probably one of the biggest users this side of McGwire/Sosa

[revo]

On what possible basis does Manny have a "before steroids" body of work? He has 2 positive tests, was purportedly on the secret 2003 list and came from a very juiced up Cleveland team. He was a known stoner throughout his career and was likey a hard core PED user throughout all of his peak power years. Probably one of the biggest users this side of McGwire/Sosa

Purportedly.....Likely.....Probably.....

He doesn't have the one trait of the other guys I mentioned before -- a performance spike anywhere in his career. He was a stud prospect, came up as a stud and stayed a stud his whole career. 20-22 years of steroids? Wow, if so, that's unreal.

[Judge Jude]

Well, I would not want to be the guy who sold him his life insurance policy...

True that from 1995-2009, he was below a 144 OPS+ only once (a 126), then still had a 138 last year.

Geesh, that 1995 Indians team went 100-44, had Carlos Baerga, Omar Vizquel, Albert Belle, Kenny Lofton, Ramirez, Eddie Murray, some bad Dave Winfield, and a little young Brian Giles (uh oh) and Jeromy Burnitz (and a cup of coffee for Billy Ripken). What a cast, and that's just the hitters.

Dennis Martinez, Orel Hershiser, Joe Table, Julian Tavarez, Paul Assenmacher, Jason Grimsley (uh oh) also aboard.

[tinitoys]

how bout jim thome? did he go come in 96?

[Moonlight J]

The new DH

[Lucky]

Okay, at what point is it "retiring", and at what point is it just "quitting"? If you just say adios during the season just to keep from getting busted for a PED, do we dignify that by calling it a retirement? Or is it a retirement any time you don't plan on coming back?

Hey, if just walking off the job and never coming back constitutes retirement, I know guys who have retired dozens of times.

We need some new terminology here. If you quit with the dogs on your trail, what should we call that?

[Moonlight J]

He filed his paperwork

[Grinch]

If you quit with the dogs on your trail, what should we call that?

Escaping punishment?

[revo]

how bout jim thome? did he go come in 96?

I'm not sure I understand what this means, but Thome became a full-timer in '94 after three part-time seasons.

[Blue&White]

I think maybe the Giants may have just found a team willing to take Huff off their hands. As a Huff owner, I'm at least hoping both teams are thinking that way!

[Moonlight J]

I think maybe the Giants may have just found a team willing to take Huff off their hands. As a Huff owner, I'm at least hoping both teams are thinking that way!

He wasn't happy here - was thrilled to leave when it happened.

I'd take him back though - but given the leverage situation, I don't see the Rays doing that unless the Giants take on a HUGE chunk of that new 2 year deal they just gave Huff.

[BC...]

Maybe the Rays should ask the Rangers about Chris Davis, rather than spend more money on an old guy. Canseco/Greg Vaughn didn't work...I didn't think Manny/Damon would work either. Just didn't think Manny was so stupid to keep taking.

[cardboardbox]

Jennings watch:

Through 3 games .385/.500/.615 13 AB 1 HR 2 SB 2/1 k/bb.

The hr is encouraging since he only hit 3 in 399 AB last year.

[RSF]

He wasn't happy here - was thrilled to leave when it happened.

I'd take him back though - but given the leverage situation, I don't see the Rays doing that unless the Giants take on a HUGE chunk of that new 2 year deal they just gave Huff.

Giants have much better leverage---they have the payroll and depth to just sit still; Rays are the team who needs to do something here. Do you think otherwise? Why?

[Moonlight J]

Giants have much better leverage---they have the payroll and depth to just sit still; Rays are the team who needs to do something here. Do you think otherwise? Why?

That's the leverage --- Rays aren't trading from a desperation standpoint. There are cheaper options, like Chris Davis