I suck as a parent

[Ken]

I know this isn't the right audience for this, but oh well.

Curious, what would you do with a child who basically calls the parenting bluff and rejects punishment?

My oldest is 10 and she has extreme anxiety. She also has disruptive mood dysregulation disorder. Big words to say, when she's angry it's fight or flight. And, to make matters extra "fun", any type of parenting now brings out that anger.

So, the kid does something wrong, we try to correct it with some minor suggestions, she gets mad and lashes out (verbally or physically - my wife has bruises all over her arms from the child), and that behavior is punished, which results in harsher penalties, but there's no end game. We take away privileges and electronics, etc, which makes her angrier and it continues to escalate. Then she "punishes" us later for taking things away from her by escalating again. There's no resolution.

I'm scared for her future. While my wife and I can/will take the abuse, I know what happens when she does this to other people and it's not pretty for anyone.

Ultimately of all the things I do, I'm worst at being a parent. I'm sure there are many other people who have had this situation and solved it, but I'm at my wits end.

[Gregg]

Ken,

Please check your PM's

[Steve 2.0]

I have no advice. I'll just say I hope you figure this out. This has to be traumatic for all of you.

[Sour Masher]

That is rough. I am sure you are already sought professional help, or you would not have a diagnosis. How long ago was she diagnosed? Has psychotherapy, parental training, and medication worked? Personally, I am dumb and too often believe I can figure things out on my own without professional help, but this definitely sounds like a professional intervention is needed, and if it is not working, seeking out someone else who might have a different approach. I get frustrated with my own kids and they are pretty good, on the whole. I would definitely need lots of training and practice to learn how to deal with this.

I imagine this is like dieting. Like dieting, parenting is hard for everyone, or most people. But some people have genetic factors that make it much, much harder. It is still doable, but requires incredible consistency and dedication, and there will still be times when you take a step back and have to regroup. With most behavior disorders, very clear, spelled out rules and consequences can be helpful, so nothing can be seen as a surprise or inconsistent or arbitrary. But it sounds like even with that sort of explicitness and consistency, it isn't enough, and that is where consistent, frequent interventions from a professional might help. At the very least, you will be reinforced that you are doing your best, which if nothing else, may help lighten the guilt and frustration a little bit.

All you can do it do everything you can, and if that still doesn't work, you have to ride it out with love and as much patience, for her and yourselves, as you can. It may not be much comfort now, but I do know of some very troubled children that did manage to straighten up later in life for whatever reason. Sometimes it is just letting their brains develop and their chemistry balancing enough to allow them to make the choice to work at getting better. Some medications are not good for a developing mind, but when she is older, they may do good. Medical marijuana, for instance, has done a lot of good for some people I know who had dealt with severe anxiety.

[chancellor]

That is rough. I am sure you are already sought professional help, or you would not have a diagnosis. How long ago was she diagnosed? Has psychotherapy, parental training, and medication worked? Personally, I am dumb and too often believe I can figure things out on my own without professional help, but this definitely sounds like a professional intervention is needed, and if it is not working, seeking out someone else who might have a different approach.

This, for sure. I'd even take it a step farther than Sour Masher, and say you need a high level professional, like a psychiatrist or pediatric neurologist if one hasn't been engaged yet. I'm a big advocate of counseling, but what you're describing is far beyond that. I'm going off a database of two - my closest friend has a son who had the exact symptoms/issues you've described, and a niece who had similar (the anxiety was not severe, but the defiance was), and my wife deals with a lot of cases like this in her special ed team at school.

If you're not getting support from your medical professionals, whoever they might be, you may want to consider engaging a mental health advocate. The National Alliance on Mental Illness (NAMI) is a great place to start to find out local support resources. If you and your spouse are unwilling to go that route, don't be afraid to be very firm with the docs/hospitals you're dealing with to get to the level of help that's needed. Make sure the docs are aware your wife has already suffered physical harm from these events.

[Ken]

That is rough. I am sure you are already sought professional help, or you would not have a diagnosis. How long ago was she diagnosed? Has psychotherapy, parental training, and medication worked? Personally, I am dumb and too often believe I can figure things out on my own without professional help, but this definitely sounds like a professional intervention is needed, and if it is not working, seeking out someone else who might have a different approach. I get frustrated with my own kids and they are pretty good, on the whole. I would definitely need lots of training and practice to learn how to deal with this.

Yeah she has been in counseling and subsequently therapy / medication for a few years. Current diagnosis is about a year old. Medications have had mixed results, we're looking at changing things up right now because it's not working ... at all.

I imagine this is like dieting. Like dieting, parenting is hard for everyone, or most people. But some people have genetic factors that make it much, much harder.
It is still doable, but requires incredible consistency and dedication, and there will still be times when you take a step back and have to regroup.

That's a good analogy, there's definitely some family history of this as well. I was naive to think that was history, I think there's a definite genetic/chemical component that makes it harder.

With most behavior disorders, very clear, spelled out rules and consequences can be helpful, so nothing can be seen as a surprise or inconsistent or arbitrary. But it sounds like even with that sort of explicitness and consistency, it isn't enough, and that is where consistent, frequent interventions from a professional might help. At the very least, you will be reinforced that you are doing your best, which if nothing else, may help lighten the guilt and frustration a little bit.

All you can do it do everything you can, and if that still doesn't work, you have to ride it out with love and as much patience, for her and yourselves, as you can. It may not be much comfort now, but I do know of some very troubled children that did manage to straighten up later in life for whatever reason. Sometimes it is just letting their brains develop and their chemistry balancing enough to allow them to make the choice to work at getting better. Some medications are not good for a developing mind, but when she is older, they may do good. Medical marijuana, for instance, has done a lot of good for some people I know who had dealt with severe anxiety.

I agree, thank you for the detailed and encouraging note

[Ken]

This, for sure. I'd even take it a step farther than Sour Masher, and say you need a high level professional, like a psychiatrist or pediatric neurologist if one hasn't been engaged yet.

You are correct, we have engaged a psychiatrist

I'm a big advocate of counseling, but what you're describing is far beyond that.

I'm going down the route of yes and. Counseling and medication both.

I'm going off a database of two - my closest friend has a son who had the exact symptoms/issues you've described, and a niece who had similar (the anxiety was not severe, but the defiance was), and my wife deals with a lot of cases like this in her special ed team at school.

Believe it or not it is nice to hear that others may have experienced something similar, I really appreciate it.

If you're not getting support from your medical professionals, whoever they might be, you may want to consider engaging a mental health advocate. The National Alliance on Mental Illness (NAMI) is a great place to start to find out local support resources. If you and your spouse are unwilling to go that route, don't be afraid to be very firm with the docs/hospitals you're dealing with to get to the level of help that's needed. Make sure the docs are aware your wife has already suffered physical harm from these events.

Good info.

Thank you for this information!!

[Moonlight J]

Same boat with my 17 year old. We have worked with a local behavioral therapist for the past 5 years and have seen some progress in that time but aren't out of the woods. We've tried to mix threapy and medication, but we're also running into issues with him being on the spectrum and completely apathy toward most things until well after the fact. There's a disconnect between the action and the reaction.

[chancellor]

Good info.

Thank you for this information!!

You are welcome. And I'm sure you don't suck as a parent - SM said it better than I could, but these types of conditions are extremely trying and difficult.

[Sour Masher]

You are welcome. And I'm sure you don't suck as a parent - SM said it better than I could, but these types of conditions are extremely trying and difficult.

Yes, I should have made that explicitly clear too. Parenting can be trying under optimal conditions, and you are dealing with extreme behavior. She may not realize it now, but your daughter is lucky to have two parents that are trying the best they can and not giving up on her. Not all parents do that. Patience is easy to preach from afar, but no one would be able to stay calm and collected and positive at all times when faced with someone you care about trying to hurt you physically or emotionally. Be patient with and forgiving of yourselves as well as her.

[Kevin Seitzer]

I don't have much I could add to the advice you've been given here, but I will also chime in and say that children failing and/or you being unable to help them like you would dearly want to help them does not make you a bad parent. It feels like it, but that's not the truth.

We recently went through getting my oldest diagnosed with autism and some other issues I'm not going to go into detail about here, but I will say that one of the good things that came out of that diagnosis for my wife and I was a realization that we were not a failure as parents in some of the ways that we had thought we were. We did our best, but we didn't realize what we were dealing with. Once we learned about the diagnosis, we didn't automatically know what to do, but it did help to cast things in a different light than "I'm a bad parent."

[Teenwolf]

I don't have much advice to share, but just wanted to say that kids and teens today face a lot more anxiety and dread from the state of the world than we did in the 80's/90's. It's normal to feel crazy when the whole world is crazy. Like the saying goes, if you're not pissed off, you're not paying attention.

I think pharmaceutical drugs are dangerous, and I'm glad that you're moving on from them. I hope you find a more beneficial program for her.

Immediately, it seems like she's having problems expressing her identity, her individuality, and feeling validation. As hard as it is for a parent, you might want to try loosening the leash. Engage her in the things that she shows interest, but try and facilitate more individual activities for her and allow her to fall on her own. Allow the world to punish her decision-making and remove yourself from the punishment side of the ledger. That way, when she's going through something hard, she'll go to her parents for comfort and support without fearing the punishment. I hope this makes sense and helps.

Whatever happens, you're doing the best that you know how, and that's all a parent can reasonably provide. Certainly not a 'bad parent'. Good luck to you and to your daughter.

[Ken]

Small improvement at home, while we have continued seeing some of the aggression, it is not every day. Combination of medication, handling situations short term better from the parent side (aka giving in / it's not worth it - not the best long term but gotta survive), and counseling.

Unfortunately this week the problems have also started being expressed at school - she's trying to "leave" the school and walk out when she's angry. Le sigh.