If Walker's a HOFer, than Todd Helton has to be a HOFer too. Helton received just 29% of the vote this year.
Announcement
Collapse
No announcement yet.
Announcement
Collapse
No announcement yet.
Baseball Hall of Fame voting
Collapse
X
-
Walker got into the Hall of Merit on his first try, iirc and fwiw.
Helton just got in this year, as the 4th of 4 (way behind Jeter but almost even with Luis Tiant and Andruw Jones. Helton placed in a near dead-heat with Kenny Lofton, who will coast in next year).
as for HOF, Schilling and Dick Allen would be a combustible pair of ex-Phillies in 2021.finished 10th in this 37th yr in 11-team-only NL 5x5
own picks 1, 2, 5, 6, 9 in April 2022 1st-rd farmhand draft
won in 2017 15 07 05 04 02 93 90 84
SP SGray 16, TWalker 10, AWood 10, Price 3, KH Kim 2, Corbin 10
RP Bednar 10, Bender 10, Graterol 2
C Stallings 2, Casali 1
1B Votto 10, 3B ERios 2, 1B Zimmerman 2, 2S Chisholm 5, 2B Hoerner 5, 2B Solano 2, 2B LGarcia 10, SS Gregorius 17
OF Cain 14, Bader 1, Daza 1
Comment
-
Originally posted by revo View PostIf Walker's a HOFer, than Todd Helton has to be a HOFer too. Helton received just 29% of the vote this year.
178
158
164
110
151
121
154
144
130
Here's what Helton (lifetime 133) did from age 30 on:
165
144
118
133
99
127
87
117
89
89
Helton's peak was incredible but he never finished higher than 5th in the MVP voting. Helton's late career resembles late career Joe Mauer (good average, great OBP, minimal power) and that was still with the advantage of Coors. Walker had his best seasons in Colorado, of course, but he also performed very well in Montreal and St. Louis, which helps soften the "he was a creation of Coors narrative." He was also a more well-rounded player than Helton and has 3 batting titles and 7 all-star appearances as opposed to 1 and 5 from Helton, respectively. I think a player with an amazing but short peak who put up his best numbers during the steroid era (as an aside, the drop off in his power after the steroid era ended is also likely to raise more eyebrows among writers) and never played outside of Coors may be a tough sell.
Comment
-
Originally posted by revo View PostIf Walker's a HOFer, than Todd Helton has to be a HOFer too. Helton received just 29% of the vote this year.If DMT didn't exist we would have to invent it. There has to be a weirdest thing. Once we have the concept weird, there has to be a weirdest thing. And DMT is simply it.
- Terence McKenna
Bullshit is everywhere. - George Carlin (& Jon Stewart)
How old would you be if you didn't know how old you are? - Satchel Paige
Comment
-
Originally posted by DMT View PostWhy? I think Walker is a no-brainer. Helton would be a wait-and-see for me, but I wouldn't have voted for him this year.
Walker: .313/.400/.565
Helton: .316/.414/.539
Walker: 1355 R, 383 HR, 1311 RBI
Helton: 1401 R, 369 HR, 1406 RBI
Walker: 141 OPS+, 72.7 WAR
Helton: 131 OPS+, 61.2 WAR
Comment
-
Walker's greater defensive value and success before and after Coors makes him a clearly better candidate - offensively and even moreso overall.
I think Helton will get in eventually.finished 10th in this 37th yr in 11-team-only NL 5x5
own picks 1, 2, 5, 6, 9 in April 2022 1st-rd farmhand draft
won in 2017 15 07 05 04 02 93 90 84
SP SGray 16, TWalker 10, AWood 10, Price 3, KH Kim 2, Corbin 10
RP Bednar 10, Bender 10, Graterol 2
C Stallings 2, Casali 1
1B Votto 10, 3B ERios 2, 1B Zimmerman 2, 2S Chisholm 5, 2B Hoerner 5, 2B Solano 2, 2B LGarcia 10, SS Gregorius 17
OF Cain 14, Bader 1, Daza 1
Comment
-
Originally posted by revo View PostBecause they're very similar players with very similar circumstances.
Walker: .313/.400/.565
Helton: .316/.414/.539
Walker: 1355 R, 383 HR, 1311 RBI
Helton: 1401 R, 369 HR, 1406 RBI
Walker: 141 OPS+, 72.7 WAR
Helton: 131 OPS+, 61.2 WAR
JAd Astra per Aspera
Oh. In that case, never mind. - Wonderboy
GITH fails logic 101. - bryanbutler
Bah...OJH caught me. - Pogues
I don't know if you guys are being willfully ignorant, but... - Judge Jude
Comment
-
Originally posted by Judge Jude View PostWalker's greater defensive value and success before and after Coors makes him a clearly better candidate - offensively and even moreso overall.
I think Helton will get in eventually.
I thought Walker was a fringy candidate, one that is usually reserved for the Veteran's Committee. Now that he's in, he may open/re-open the door for others who weren't even given a sniff or thought to have much of a chance:
- Jim Edmonds
- Matt Holliday
- Lance Berkman
- Luis Gonzalez
- Fred McGriff
- Carlos Delgado
- Rafael Palmeiro
- Bobby Grich
- Kenny Lofton
- Dwight Evans
- Graig Nettles
etc etc
Comment
-
Originally posted by revo View PostWhich is my point, thanks.
I thought Walker was a fringy candidate, one that is usually reserved for the Veteran's Committee. Now that he's in, he may open/re-open the door for others who weren't even given a sniff or thought to have much of a chance:
- Jim Edmonds
- Matt Holliday
- Lance Berkman
- Luis Gonzalez
- Fred McGriff
- Carlos Delgado
- Rafael Palmeiro
- Bobby Grich
- Kenny Lofton
- Dwight Evans
- Graig Nettles
etc etc
Comment
-
HALL OF MERIT STATUS
- Jim Edmonds IN
- Matt Holliday NOT ELIGIBLE
- Lance Berkman GETS VOTES
- Luis Gonzalez DOESN'T GET VOTES
- Fred McGriff GETS VOTES
- Carlos Delgado DOESN'T GET VOTES
- Rafael Palmeiro IN
- Bobby Grich IN, EASILY
- Kenny Lofton FIRST RUNNERUP THS YEAR, GETS IN NEXT YEAR
- Dwight Evans IN
- Graig Nettles INfinished 10th in this 37th yr in 11-team-only NL 5x5
own picks 1, 2, 5, 6, 9 in April 2022 1st-rd farmhand draft
won in 2017 15 07 05 04 02 93 90 84
SP SGray 16, TWalker 10, AWood 10, Price 3, KH Kim 2, Corbin 10
RP Bednar 10, Bender 10, Graterol 2
C Stallings 2, Casali 1
1B Votto 10, 3B ERios 2, 1B Zimmerman 2, 2S Chisholm 5, 2B Hoerner 5, 2B Solano 2, 2B LGarcia 10, SS Gregorius 17
OF Cain 14, Bader 1, Daza 1
Comment
-
Originally posted by Ken View PostIf Palmeiro gets in and Bonds/Clemens do not I'd love to hear the rationale. Same offense, much worse player.
Comment
-
Originally posted by revo View PostWhich is my point, thanks.
I thought Walker was a fringy candidate, one that is usually reserved for the Veteran's Committee. Now that he's in, he may open/re-open the door for others who weren't even given a sniff or thought to have much of a chance:
- Jim Edmonds
- Matt Holliday
- Lance Berkman
- Luis Gonzalez
- Fred McGriff
- Carlos Delgado
- Rafael Palmeiro
- Bobby Grich
- Kenny Lofton
- Dwight Evans
- Graig Nettles
etc etc
Comment
-
Originally posted by Ken View PostIf Palmeiro gets in and Bonds/Clemens do not I'd love to hear the rationale. Same offense, much worse player.---------------------------------------------
Champagne for breakfast and a Sherman in my hand !
---------------------------------------------
The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
George Orwell, 1984
Comment
Comment