Police Officers Are Mostly Parasites

[GwynnInTheHall]

Police routinely fabricating evidence of gunshots that didn't exist to obtain convictions:

https://www.vice.com/en/article/qj8x...t-detecting-ai

Again, not at all surprising.

We need a police force to police the police.

[Bene Futuis]

Again, not at all surprising.

We need a police force to police the police.

What is the point of diminishing the horrors that Seitzer is posting by repeating "not at all surprising" over and over? This shit is very surprising and should not just be treated as the cost of doing business with the police. Ending qualified immunity altogether will help create causes of action against the bad actors who commit intentional frauds upon the public in order to wrongfully obtain convictions. There have been very strong pushes in multiple state-level jurisdictions to eliminate or dramatically change qualified immunity - these are the direct result of the George Floyd protests, imo, and are making an enormous difference in their communities. But more needs to be done to ensure that these fraudsters do not go unpunished.

[GwynnInTheHall]

What is the point of diminishing the horrors that Seitzer is posting by repeating "not at all surprising" over and over? This shit is very surprising and should not just be treated as the cost of doing business with the police. Ending qualified immunity altogether will help create causes of action against the bad actors who commit intentional frauds upon the public in order to wrongfully obtain convictions. There have been very strong pushes in multiple state-level jurisdictions to eliminate or dramatically change qualified immunity - these are the direct result of the George Floyd protests, imo, and are making an enormous difference in their communities. But more needs to be done to ensure that these fraudsters do not go unpunished.

It's not at all meant to diminish this shit. I have advocated for change in law enforcement every moment of my existence on RJ. What I mean by--not surprising is that I expect LE to be corrupt in some manner in most places--I agree with all your proposals and have advocated for the same and more in my past posts.

Yes the protests were somewhat effective in restarting the conversation and though there has been some change, it's been minimal. I'd LOVE to see wholesale changes made Nationwide, but that required as daily In Your face reminder and the current political climate seems to only address the issue of the day and as we've seen, not quickly or effectively enough to say--we're making progress.

So yeah, if they discover a mass grave under a precinct somewhere--I won't be surprised--Saddened, outraged, but not surprised and I in no way--say that or intend for that to diminish the importance or egregiousness of the situation.

Trust me when I say--I am certain we see this in exactly the same manner.

[Bene Futuis]

This is a bad one.


Philadelphia police were at the scene of a protest after the police killed Walter Wallace, Jr. A black woman, Rickia Young, accidentally drove up to the scene of the protest on her way home from work, not even knowing there was a protest going on. Realizing her error, she attempted to make a three point turn to get out of there. Instead of doing their jobs or acting like human beings, Philly cops smashed her windows in, dragged her out of the car, and forcibly separated her from her young teenage nephew and two year old son. Her two year old son, who is deaf, either had his hearing aids taken away or otherwise lost during the fracas. Ms. Young was handcuffed for hours and ultimately faced no charges because obviously she hadn't done a damn thing wrong.

Here's the especially rough part: the Fraternal Order of Police, the largest police union in the country, posted A FACEBOOK PICTURE of the cops holding Ms. Young's deaf child, sans hearing aids, with this caption: "This child was lost during the violent riots in Philadelphia, wandering around barefoot in an area that was experiencing complete lawlessness. The only thing this Philadelphia Police Officer cared about in that moment was protecting this child."

So rage inducing. Edit: Cost the city of Philadelphia $2 million to settle with her. A couple cops lost their jobs, sure to be rehired elsewhere post haste.

[Roy Hobbs]

.....yet I can see all of you calling the police if someone was breaking into your house. Hate on them all you want, but at the end of the day you want them.

[The Feral Slasher]

.....yet I can see all of you calling the police if someone was breaking into your house. Hate on them all you want, but at the end of the day you want them.

i certainly want police. That doesn't mean that i have to accept it if they are corrupt, excessively violent, or racist. I am not sure why anyone would accept this.

[GwynnInTheHall]

.....yet I can see all of you calling the police if someone was breaking into your house. Hate on them all you want, but at the end of the day you want them.

Is everything you utter a conservative trope?

[chancellor]

https://www.themarshallproject.org/2...-er-every-year



That is deeply troubling.

Perhaps. Not differentiating between police and security guards immediately makes me question the quality of the data source. Following your posted article, I'm more convinced by the San Jose data - that's actual police data over an extended time.

That indicates 1300 hospitalizations over a four-year period, in a city of over a million with a growing homeless problem. 72 with serious injuries and 9 killed over four years.

[The Feral Slasher]

Perhaps. Not differentiating between police and security guards immediately makes me question the quality of the data source. Following your posted article, I'm more convinced by the San Jose data - that's actual police data over an extended time.

That indicates 1300 hospitalizations over a four-year period, in a city of over a million with a growing homeless problem. 72 with serious injuries and 9 killed over four years.

I'm not sure the stats you quote aren't troubling. I suppose America has a lot of guns and violence in our culture, which makes it hard for police. However, I don't just accept that that is ok. Could increased police accountability make things better ? I was wondering how we compare to European countries, and a quick search found the article below. A lot of ways to look at things, but from all I have seen our system of holding police accountable is not effective at all.

https://theconversation.com/why-do-american-cops-kill-so-many-compared-to-european-cops-49696

Knife violence is a big problem in England, yet British police have fatally shot only one person wielding a knife since 2008 – a hostage-taker. By comparison, my calculations based on data compiled by fatalencounters.org and the Washington Post show that US police have fatally shot more than 575 people allegedly wielding blades and other such weapons just in the years since 2013.

[GwynnInTheHall]

Perhaps. Not differentiating between police and security guards immediately makes me question the quality of the data source. Following your posted article, I'm more convinced by the San Jose data - that's actual police data over an extended time.

That indicates 1300 hospitalizations over a four-year period, in a city of over a million with a growing homeless problem. 72 with serious injuries and 9 killed over four years.

I love ya bro, but if your inferring that systemic racism isn't a thing in our LEO system

I'd call you out for another GTFO wager......

I love my little brother, but I have seen what the system has done to him.

He bulldozzed his family, he did it to me when my mother passed, they are trained to think anyone who is NOT them are the enemy.

In my 60 years on this earth I have NEVER called the cops, NEVER had any interaction with a cop outside of my brother and his pals. Sure, I have gotten a traffic ticket, but even then--I've experienced privilege as more than one LEO has allowed me to drive home drunk because, IMO, I was white and they had seen my brothers LACSD picture in my wallet.

I do NOT think every cop is shit, BUT I DO think there are serious issue we need to address i our current law enforcement system.

Again bro, I love ya--but to ignore that there are a shit ton of cops who are shit--is just willful.

[chancellor]

I love ya bro, but if your inferring that systemic racism isn't a thing in our LEO system

Didn't say it, didn't infer it. However, those stats aren't alarming to me, once they're broken down. That could change if I knew more about the high injury cases, which is omitted from the link Seitzer shared. Others mileage may vary.

[Sour Masher]

Here is a site that compares police killings globally. The US ranks 6th in the world. 24% of police killings in the US are black, about twice what you would expect if race were not a factor, although it is below the 38% of the prison population that is black. Overall, the number of police shootings and the number of police shootings of black citizens is trending down. But of course, needs to go down even more and more needs to be done to make that happen: https://worldpopulationreview.com/co...ngs-by-country

But here again I will make the argument that solutions for improvement must be grounded in the reality that policing is necessary in some form, and that the systemic racism in our society as a whole creates a situation where it is inevitable that more black people are killed by police than white people. The system that has created inequity, poverty, oppression, lack of opportunity, has led to a society black folks live in areas with more crime and more risk. Black folks in this country age 10-34 are 13 times more likely to die from homicide than white folks in that age group. So, it is a complicated issue. On the one hand, more black people are scrutinized and arrested and shot for things many white people get away with, because they live in communities with more violence and more policing. But you can't just not police these areas, because there is more crime in them, so they need it the most.

Long term, the solution is to face, admit, and address the systemic racism in our society which has deep roots in our history and change these communities so there is more opportunity. Shorter term, we need to take more steps to breakdown the narrative of black vs blue, which is bad for all involved. A big part of that should be education of LEOs so they understand the story of black people in this country and more specifically of the people in the communities they serve. Absent that, it is not surprising that many LEO's have their opinions shaped by the interactions with the worst of the communities they serve, which just reinforce natural prejudices and continues the cycles. It is a big, complex problem. I hope that continued decriminalization of non-violent drug crimes will be a big step toward improvement.

[Kevin Seitzer]

But you can't just not police these areas, because there is more crime in them, so they need it the most.

I agree with most of what you wrote, but I think this statement needs a caveat. Even the definition and accounting of crime is affected by systemic racism and structural biases. One example that brought this home for me was that if you steal $100 from your employer, that's a crime. The police will come and arrest you. If your employer steals $100 from your paycheck, that's an administrative action that requires you to file a complaint with the attorney general and is not dealt with as a crime. Want to guess which problem dwarfs which? It's not the one that's counted as a crime and has the police involved.

Also, the presence of police in "high-crime" areas tends to find "crime" that would otherwise go unreported/unnoticed. A self-fulfilling prophecy, if you will. The war on drugs is the most obvious example of this. Depending on the study you look at, black people are 2-7 times more likely than white people to be arrested for low-level misdemeanor offenses.

[Sour Masher]

I agree with most of what you wrote, but I think this statement needs a caveat. Even the definition and accounting of crime is affected by systemic racism and structural biases. One example that brought this home for me was that if you steal $100 from your employer, that's a crime. The police will come and arrest you. If your employer steals $100 from your paycheck, that's an administrative action that requires you to file a complaint with the attorney general and is not dealt with as a crime. Want to guess which problem dwarfs which? It's not the one that's counted as a crime and has the police involved.

Also, the presence of police in "high-crime" areas tends to find "crime" that would otherwise go unreported/unnoticed. A self-fulfilling prophecy, if you will. The war on drugs is the most obvious example of this. Depending on the study you look at, black people are 2-7 times more likely than white people to be arrested for low-level misdemeanor offenses.

All of this is true. I should have specified violent crime, as I was thinking of the much higher rates of homicide--not only are black Americans, especially males, more likely to be killed by the police, they are much, much more likely to be killed by non-police. As I mentioned at the end, I am very hopeful we continue to decriminalize non-violent offenses, especially ones most white people get away with just by living in less policed areas. But the violent crime in many areas is a real problem, exacerbated by the fact that many do not feel safe calling the police or cooperating with them. That needs to change, but the solution is not simply moving police from those areas.

[Bene Futuis]

.....yet I can see all of you calling the police if someone was breaking into your house. Hate on them all you want, but at the end of the day you want them.

I always thought this was just the dumbest "gotcha" argument. So if the garbage collectors are chucking your cans through your windows and scaring your kids and generally acting like menaces, you'd just say "hate on them all you want, but at the end of the day you want your garbage picked up", right? To which I'd answer, "Well, no shit. But since we are paying the garbage collectors' salaries, perhaps we can reasonably expect them to act professionally, with adequate training, and in a manner that always reflects respectful interaction because, as we know, we are paying these people to provide us a service and most definitely have the right to demand improvements when the service being provided sucks." Because at the end of the day, we want competent, well-trained police but that's not what we are getting.