Libertarianism and the balance between individual rights and anti-interventionism

[baldgriff]

How about the liberty of all the victims of the wars we've been fighting for the past 240 years?

You already know and I have stated over and over again that the US should not be "spreading freedom" by the use of might. That said, Im glad we were on the winning side of WWI and WWII.....

[DMT]

DMT -
I have not ever denied any of the things that you mentioned above. There is no incessant denial of what occurred. I honestly believe that those words can and should be applied to everyone in this country. We - all citizens of this country - should be able to partake in the Liberty that was one of the ideals of the Founding Fathers.

The more times we ask government to run our lives the less liberty we have.

Without government the rich would take everything. Look at how much they've taken with government. This is all perfectly acceptable to you of course because every dollar should be treated the same. Except for capital gains of course because...LIBERTY!

[nots]

Without government the rich would take everything. Look at how much they've taken with government. This is all perfectly acceptable to you of course because every dollar should be treated the same. Except for capital gains of course because...LIBERTY!

Most of the world treats capital gains different than ordinary income. Doesn’t make it right, but we are far from alone in how do it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_gains_tax

[nots]

I would love to see him run as the Libertarian from the get go. Otherwise it just looks like an expedient way to stay in the race.

Part of me wishes he would stay a Libertarian and give the party the credibility that Johnson squandered last time, but part of me is glad he is taking on Trump. Given the MSM distaste for Trump, I think he is going to get a lot of coverage and nearly all of it will be positive. It’s probably too much to hope that he fights a good primary fight and then accepts the Libertarian nomination, but fingers crossed I guess.

[B-Fly]

Most of the world treats capital gains different than ordinary income. Doesn’t make it right, but we are far from alone in how do it.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_gains_tax

Most of the world, throughout global history, has privileged the privileged, valuing wealth over work.

[baldgriff]

Without government the rich would take everything. Look at how much they've taken with government. This is all perfectly acceptable to you of course because every dollar should be treated the same. Except for capital gains of course because...LIBERTY!

Why is it that you continue to misstate what I actually believe when we have had the discussion. As you can see I was very clear in the "Economic, taxes and tariffs discussion:

All earned income should be taxed at the same rate. I dont care how you "earned/made" it - tax it all at the same level. "Capital Gains" is money earned - by wise investing, but why tax it differently. Dividends and Interest are also an income stream - tax it likewise.

I absolutely DO NOT BELIEVE capital gains should be treated any different. Thanks for playing!

[DMT]

Why is it that you continue to misstate what I actually believe when we have had the discussion. As you can see I was very clear in the "Economic, taxes and tariffs discussion:

I absolutely DO NOT BELIEVE capital gains should be treated any different. Thanks for playing!

Sorry, I confused that position with the billionth dollar earned should be taxed the same as the first.

[baldgriff]

Sorry, I confused that position with the billionth dollar earned should be taxed the same as the first.

Yep - every dollar earned should be taxed the same. You just want to take more from someone because they managed to make more..... no matter how they made it.


and then allow for multiple ways to lower your earned income - so that you can exempt income from being taxed or at least reduced. Peter giving to Paul......

[DMT]

Yep - every dollar earned should be taxed the same. You just want to take more from someone because they managed to make more..... no matter how they made it.

and then allow for multiple ways to lower your earned income - so that you can exempt income from being taxed or at least reduced. Peter giving to Paul......

I've never voiced support for the ridiculous loopholes that allow rich people to avoid taxes but thanks for trying.

As for your tax position, income inequality continues to rise so let's lower taxes on rich people. Makes perfect sense. WRONG. It's absolutely absurd and the fact that you continue to openly state your support for it shows how you don't even recognize how ridiculous you sound.

[baldgriff]

I've never voiced support for the ridiculous loopholes that allow rich people to avoid taxes but thanks for trying.

As for your tax position, income inequality continues to rise so let's lower taxes on rich people. Makes perfect sense. WRONG. It's absolutely absurd and the fact that you continue to openly state your support for it shows how you don't even recognize how ridiculous you sound.

If you support Capital Gains being taxed at a lower rate (which I assume that you do - based on your flame of me above) then you support some loopholes as to minimizing income or lowering tax responsibility based on how the money is earned. In fact - if you support Capital Gains being charged a lower tax rate than Earned Income you are giving the Rich (who take everything) a leg up on those that dont have the means to take advantage of Capital Gains.

You can call me ridiculous - and honestly I dont care! Im consistent and see no reason that every dollar made/earned shouldnt be taxed in the same manner.

[DMT]

If you support Capital Gains being taxed at a lower rate (which I assume that you do - based on your flame of me above) then you support some loopholes as to minimizing income or lowering tax responsibility based on how the money is earned. In fact - if you support Capital Gains being charged a lower tax rate than Earned Income you are giving the Rich (who take everything) a leg up on those that dont have the means to take advantage of Capital Gains.

You can call me ridiculous - and honestly I dont care! Im consistent and see no reason that every dollar made/earned shouldnt be taxed in the same manner.

Why would I support capital gains being taxed at a lower rate? I know you don't care, I only respond to make sure that you never mistake silence for acquiescence.

[baldgriff]

Why would I support capital gains being taxed at a lower rate? I know you don't care, I only respond to make sure that you never mistake silence for acquiescence.

So then we both agree that Capital Gains should NOT be taxed at a different rate than other earned income. We may have found an area of common grounds.

Or do you feel that Capital Gains should be taxed at a Higher Rate - since only the rich people get it?


Edit to add: Im not looking for acquiescence or anything like that. I want an honest exchange of ideas with the intent to understand why one feels or holds a certain position. I also hope to find areas of agreement - so that those are places to build on.

[DMT]

I would be fine with increasing rates to match income as a starting point. A Wall St transaction tax is also solely needed.

[baldgriff]

I would be fine with increasing rates to match income as a starting point. A Wall St transaction tax is also solely needed.

So Income and Capital Gains taxed at the same rates?

Please define Wall St tax. Im not familiar with that term.

[DMT]

So Income and Capital Gains taxed at the same rates?

Please define Wall St tax. Im not familiar with that term.

I'm sure this gives a better overview than I could.

https://www.epi.org/publication/a-financial-transaction-tax-would-help-ensure-wall-street-works-for-main-street/