Page 9 of 9 FirstFirst ... 789
Results 81 to 87 of 87

Thread: 10 unsettling answers to the fermi paradox

  1. #81
    Big Leaguer Kevin Seitzer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    3,117
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve 2.0 View Post
    Geez Louise, J. How many other planets have WE been to? I go back to my original statement, that there is a HELL of a lot of distance between galaxies. I'm not going to say there has to be life on other planets - (I think there probably is), but your hypothesis that if there were spacefaring life elsewhere in the galaxy, they'd have been here by now, makes no sense!!!! The galaxy is huge!!! (and space travel is freaking dangerous, to boot.)
    I've been reading through a series on the American and Soviet space programs (Outward Odyssey series from University of Nebraska Press), and one thing that I didn't realize is how many astronauts have died. I was, of course, aware of the three Americans who died in Apollo 1, the seven who died on Challenger, and the seven who died on Columbia. But I wasn't aware of all the Soviet fatalities. And when you think about it on a percentage basis, and what very limited things we have tried (mostly orbiting within a couple hundred miles of the surface of our own planet), and how close we have come to a lot of other fatalities, it is quite sobering.

    There haven't been that many of us in space out of the ~100 billion people who have ever lived on earth. At last count, 561, and they have their own Wikipedia page:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...velers_by_name

    And only 24 people have ventured out of earth orbit, in the fifty years we've been doing that sort of thing.

    At the moment, there are three people in space, out of 8 billion of us.
    Last edited by Kevin Seitzer; 01-18-2019 at 09:32 PM.
    "There was nothing for him to do under the truck, but it's tough to blame him now that he is dead." -V.Erps 3/26/2005

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by onejayhawk View Post
    The video is by hopeful dreamers that cannot handle the depressing math.

    None of the scenarios represent a reasonable situation. If there has been one visitor there must have been many thousand. I might believe dozens or hundreds in recorded history, which brings us back to archeology. Further, there is the background noise we are not hearing. If there were spacefaring life elsewhere in the galaxy it would be here, now. There is a reason SF writers make up wild excuses for lack of prior alien contact. It's because only the wildly improbable lets them write a story.

    J
    Please explain why "if there were spacefaring life elsewhere in the galaxy, it would be here, now"
    "You know what's wrong with America? If I lovingly tongue a woman's nipple in a movie, it gets an "NC-17" rating, if I chop it off with a machete, it's an "R". That's what's wrong with America, man...."--Dennis Hopper

    "One should judge a man mainly from his depravities. Virtues can be faked. Depravities are real." -- Klaus Kinski

  3. #83
    Big Leaguer The Feral Slasher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    2,690
    Quote Originally Posted by onejayhawk View Post
    The video is by hopeful dreamers that cannot handle the depressing math.

    None of the scenarios represent a reasonable situation. If there has been one visitor there must have been many thousand. I might believe dozens or hundreds in recorded history, which brings us back to archeology. Further, there is the background noise we are not hearing. If there were spacefaring life elsewhere in the galaxy it would be here, now. There is a reason SF writers make up wild excuses for lack of prior alien contact. It's because only the wildly improbable lets them write a story.

    J
    Lol. There are probably stupid self appointed genius aliens on their own version of the internet spouting the same stupid shit because we haven't visited them yet.

  4. #84
    Big Leaguer The Feral Slasher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    2,690
    Quote Originally Posted by Fresno Bob View Post
    Please explain why "if there were spacefaring life elsewhere in the galaxy, it would be here, now"
    Well we humans are spacefaring life and we have explored the entire galaxy so it must be true of other potential life , right ?

  5. #85
    Big Leaguer Sour Masher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Binghamton, NY
    Posts
    4,702
    Quote Originally Posted by rhd View Post
    A few things:

    1 - From the video that Nully referred to in the original post: "... the universe might be so vast that, while it might have hundreds of civilizations in it, the numbers are still in favor of that, but they are so far from each other that they may never be able to communicate, or, if they do, it wont happen for billions of years." That is a quote from Arthur C. Clarke, which starts at about 8:42 of the video.
    2 - Maybe there have been many intelligent civilizations, even in our own galaxy, but these may have existed only for a short period of time, destroyed either by a natural event (gamma ray burst, nearby supernova, asteroid/planet impact, etc.) or by themselves (nuclear bombs, super-intelligent hostile robots, "grey goo", etc.). This also was mentioned in the video. They may tend to get wiped out before they have a chance to communicate with or travel to other intelligent civilizations.
    3 - Species much more intelligent than us could evolve but w/o the ability to make sophisticated tools (like super intelligent sea creatures, like dolphins and whales). These creatures would effectively be stuck on their home planet and also prevented from being able to create the technology to explore the cosmos or find other civilizations.
    4 - Another item that noone's mentioned yet: Among all the seemingly rare characteristics of the Earth, another may be our relatively small size. Scientists think now that habitable "super-earths", at least 2-3 times bigger than Earth, may be much more common than Earth-sized planets. This could impact a species' ability to travel away from their planet. It's hard enough for spacecraft to escape the Earth's gravity (must exceed 25,000 mph). It would be much harder to escape a much bigger planet w much more gravity. So, even if an intelligent species had the ability to make sophisticated tools, they could still be trapped on their home planet.
    Yes to all of this. Thanks for typing it out.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Fresno Bob View Post
    Please explain why "if there were spacefaring life elsewhere in the galaxy, it would be here, now"
    It's extremely straight forward and well understood. Organisms of all size move into unexploited resources. On a microscopic level, bacteria will saturate of growth medium. The question is not if but how long it will take. With suitable adjustments this is true for multicelled orgaisms and animals. The only restricing factor is mobility until a competitor enters the picture.

    Everything we know about the local universe says that it is a virgin field. If we never encounter a competing species, homo sapiens will cover the Milky Way in a few hundred to a couple thousand generations. 100,000 years is roughly 4000 generations , ie more than enough time. Yet 10 times that is a relative heartbeat for the galaxy itself. Other reagions of the Milky Way are more mature than this one, so all factors being equal, intelligent life should have developed millions of years ago and many times before. Given that mobility is given as a factor for inclusion, they should have spread here. Indeed, there should be competing factions, just as we see in all terrestrial biological systems.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Feral Slasher View Post
    Well we humans are spacefaring life and we have explored the entire galaxy so it must be true of other potential life , right ?
    That is a valid extrapolation, yes.

    J
    Ad Astra per Aspera

    Oh. In that case, never mind. - Wonderboy

    GITH fails logic 101. - bryanbutler

    Bah...OJH caught me. - Pogues

    I don't know if you guys are being willfully ignorant, but... - Judge Jude

  7. #87
    Big Leaguer The Feral Slasher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    2,690
    Quote Originally Posted by onejayhawk View Post
    It's extremely straight forward and well understood. Organisms of all size move into unexploited resources. On a microscopic level, bacteria will saturate of growth medium. The question is not if but how long it will take. With suitable adjustments this is true for multicelled orgaisms and animals. The only restricing factor is mobility until a competitor enters the picture.

    Everything we know about the local universe says that it is a virgin field. If we never encounter a competing species, homo sapiens will cover the Milky Way in a few hundred to a couple thousand generations. 100,000 years is roughly 4000 generations , ie more than enough time. Yet 10 times that is a relative heartbeat for the galaxy itself. Other reagions of the Milky Way are more mature than this one, so all factors being equal, intelligent life should have developed millions of years ago and many times before. Given that mobility is given as a factor for inclusion, they should have spread here. Indeed, there should be competing factions, just as we see in all terrestrial biological systems.



    That is a valid extrapolation, yes.

    J
    trollin, trollin, trollin....

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •