Page 737 of 740 FirstFirst ... 237637687727735736737738739 ... LastLast
Results 7,361 to 7,370 of 7397

Thread: Election 2020

  1. #7361
    Quote Originally Posted by chancellor View Post
    Two other kudos I'll throw out:

    - Again, for Teenwolf, even I thought his denunciation of the press relative to soft-pedaling Biden was too strong. After what happened to Glenn Greenwald; however, Teenwolf was proven correct. While Matt Taibbi officially still writes for Rolling Stone, he's limited in what he can put out there, and has moved the bulk of his writing over to Substack. Glenn Greenwald was outright fired - from a news system he helped create - and also now writes on Substack. These are two very liberal writers who have been partially or fully run off their primary publications for daring to challenge the narrative.

    - I'm pretty sure this is the sixth consecutive election GITH has called right.
    Greenwald and Taibbi aren't liberal, they're contrarian. They both ran with the Biden as rapist story (like TW), and then when that went poof, they jumped on the Hunter's laptop story which was equally absurd. Greenwald, particularly, has come completely unhinged with his hatred of the Democratic Party.
    If DMT didn't exist we would have to invent it. There has to be a weirdest thing. Once we have the concept weird, there has to be a weirdest thing. And DMT is simply it.
    - Terence McKenna

    Bullshit is everywhere. - George Carlin (& Jon Stewart)

    How old would you be if you didn't know how old you are? - Satchel Paige

  2. #7362
    Quote Originally Posted by DMT View Post
    Greenwald and Taibbi aren't liberal, they're contrarian. They both ran with the Biden as rapist story (like TW), and then when that went poof, they jumped on the Hunter's laptop story which was equally absurd. Greenwald, particularly, has come completely unhinged with his hatred of the Democratic Party.
    I'll have to disagree with you on Taibbi in particular. I guess you could call Greenwald more of a "liberalatarian"; despite my policy disagreements with him, he's always been a staunch First Amendment supporter. He's the reporter version of what the ACLU used to be, but is admittedly no longer.
    I'm just here for the baseball.

  3. #7363
    All Star fuhrdog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    5,249
    Serious question...other than Biden, which Dems that ran against Biden for the nomination do you think would have also won against Trump if they were the nominee?

  4. #7364
    Quote Originally Posted by fuhrdog View Post
    Serious question...other than Biden, which Dems that ran against Biden for the nomination do you think would have also won against Trump if they were the nominee?
    I think the only other possible winners would've been Klobuchar, Booker and Harris. None of them would've done as well as Biden IMO, and that is a sad admission.
    If DMT didn't exist we would have to invent it. There has to be a weirdest thing. Once we have the concept weird, there has to be a weirdest thing. And DMT is simply it.
    - Terence McKenna

    Bullshit is everywhere. - George Carlin (& Jon Stewart)

    How old would you be if you didn't know how old you are? - Satchel Paige

  5. #7365
    Quote Originally Posted by fuhrdog View Post
    Serious question...other than Biden, which Dems that ran against Biden for the nomination do you think would have also won against Trump if they were the nominee?
    A lot of them. If you limit it to just the candidates who made the primaries, I've already given my POV that Warren would have won, but I also think Klobuchar, Buttigieg, Bloomberg, and Patrick would have beat him, too. I actually think Sanders would receive more votes, but would have struggled in Pennsylvania, Georgia, and Arizona. But he might have pulled it off, too. Heck, if the DNC would have gotten behind Yang, he could have won, too. If this were a conventional election, that's probably not the case. But this wasn't a conventional election - as, I think it was revo who noted, so many voters voted against Trump and not for Biden, and any of those candidates would have also received those votes. I also think all of them would have outperformed Biden on the campaign trail and especially in the debates to the point that would overcome their lack of name recognition compared to Biden. Again, others mileage may vary.
    I'm just here for the baseball.

  6. #7366
    Journeyman Teenwolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Thunder Bay, ON, CAN
    Posts
    3,097
    Quote Originally Posted by revo View Post

    I'm sure there are many more. I just have other things to do right now.
    Not entirely accurate to show that I've said Biden would lose to Trump when nearly all of your quotes are from the primary. I've said Biden would win fairly consistently since he became the nominee, although I was skeptical of his lead sizes, and I believed the hidden Trump vote of 3-4% was real. Only the Covid quote do I say he's going to lose, but I base it off speculation on a massive Covid surge and further speculation on the results of that, so it's about as relevant as spring training stats.

    5 quotes. 1st one I talk about how Covid will affect voters and I end by saying "it won't be pretty". It wasn't technically a loss, but it sure wasn't pretty. 2nd quote is talking about down-ballot losses, so it's taken entirely out of context. Quotes 3-5 are all from the primary, when Bernie was still in the race, all before Covid-19 was a factor, not from the general election. I could find a dozen quotes where I support Biden winning throughout the general, though I expressed more pessimism than most about lead sizes, and I definitely indicated that the "secret Trump vote" of 3-4% was real, which was proven correct. I'm clearly referring to Biden as a "loser" as a personality trait, like messaging that Republicans are good people who just happen to support a lunatic... Registered R voted at 90% Trump in '16, up to 93% in '20! Winning messaging, yeah fucking right!

    It's impossible to sort through all the variables that Covid had an affect on this election, but Trump won the majority of votes in more than 90% of the 376 US counties with the highest number of new COVID-19 cases per capita... that's fucking nuts. You can't predict people to vote so hard in the opposite of their best interest, but there you go. Biden didn't lose due to Covid, he likely won because of it. Chancellor is right, if Covid were not an issue and Biden were forced to campaign out of his basement, with the rigorous schedule that involves, we would have seen a very different matchup between Trump and Biden. Given that voters split 70/30 on the issue of Covid handling in favor of Democrats, it's possible Biden would have been obliterated if not for the disease and being able to simplify his message to "follow science, wear a mask", etc.

    I was the one jumping up and down saying "this campaign of "Orange Man Bad" isn't ENOUGH!" You were saying "BIDEN IS CRUSHING IT!!1!! Check out the latest polls!" Well, was it enough or wasn't it?! Seems to me, given the down-ballot losses due to Biden's horrible messaging that Trump was an aberration and not reflective of the Republican party, Biden won't be able to do much except give the Republicans what they want, which was his plan all along anyway. I've seen mixed signals so far, but the latest appointment of a fossil fuel executive to an environmental advisory role is a very bad sign that he wants to literally skull-fuck every progressive to death. Or maybe metaphorically, I get those terms confused.

  7. #7367
    Journeyman Teenwolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Thunder Bay, ON, CAN
    Posts
    3,097
    Quote Originally Posted by chancellor View Post
    A lot of them. If you limit it to just the candidates who made the primaries, I've already given my POV that Warren would have won, but I also think Klobuchar, Buttigieg, Bloomberg, and Patrick would have beat him, too. I actually think Sanders would receive more votes, but would have struggled in Pennsylvania, Georgia, and Arizona. But he might have pulled it off, too. Heck, if the DNC would have gotten behind Yang, he could have won, too. If this were a conventional election, that's probably not the case. But this wasn't a conventional election - as, I think it was revo who noted, so many voters voted against Trump and not for Biden, and any of those candidates would have also received those votes. I also think all of them would have outperformed Biden on the campaign trail and especially in the debates to the point that would overcome their lack of name recognition compared to Biden. Again, others mileage may vary.
    I appreciate your honesty. I obviously think Sanders would have won because he would have tied the pandemic to his governmental policies that directly help people, he would have advocated for badly needed stimulus that's been mutually blocked by both parties for political theatre. The renter's crisis that you spoke of months ago, where 50% of the renters in some states were months behind on rent, those folks would have had a public advocate for their stimulus. I think it would have been an entirely different campaign and mobilized different people, but if you look at Sanders primary numbers, he dominated Biden with Latinos, which were an area Biden struggled across the board. Sanders' public speaking and ability to show empathy, as well as broader messaging than simply "Trump is bad", and many other political skills he possesses, I think he would have crushed Trump.

    I disagree that Bloomberg or Buttigieg could have beat Trump. Their personal failings would have been perfect fodder for Trump to weaponize. Possibly the same with Klobuchar, her prosecutorial record, her issues with the Black Lives Matter movement, would have found difficulty uniting the left, but she's a definite Biden proxy for the "hold your nose" type. I'm glad you don't mention Harris beating Trump, as I don't think she would have. People have such amnesia as to her failings in the primary.

    Yang could have done it because there are so many people who want the "anything but status-quo" option that Trump represented, I think he had the best shot at flipping Trump voters to his populist messaging. Other than Yang and Sanders, nobody could have galvanized enough of a united front among Democrats, or drawn away enough Trump voters to pull off the POTUS and down-ballot wins that would prevent absolute gridlock for the next 4 years. You need a movement built on prescriptive policies, not "that guy is uniquely immoral". Morality holds less currency in politics all of the time. Q-anon is in the building.

  8. #7368
    Administrator revo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    fuggedabboutit
    Posts
    21,788
    Biden won 306-232. He leads by 6 million votes. Everyone doubted him. He held up his end of the bargain.

  9. #7369
    Journeyman Teenwolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Thunder Bay, ON, CAN
    Posts
    3,097
    Quote Originally Posted by DMT View Post
    There is no way the polls are capturing all the first time voters who want Trump gone. It's gonna be a landslide.
    I really appreciated your post recognizing that America is a worse country than you had thought from a few days after you posted the prediction above. I agree it should have been a landslide, and that's from someone who loathes Joe Biden.

    But I knew it would be closer than it should be, and you consistently called me a Trump fan and all this nonsense when I spoke up saying Biden needed to do more to reach his base and non-voters. Bernie Sanders had the nuance to say "if elected Biden would have the most progressive agenda in the history of the country" while also saying "he needs to speak more to the immediate concerns of voters and stop focusing so much on how Trump is a unique danger". Bernie wasn't lying about the first part, he just wanted a cudgel to push his "good friend Joe" to do the right thing on issues over the next 4 years. I think he did enough emphatic endorsement of Biden to earn the right to criticize him now when he tries to shut out progressives.

    The time to fight over supporting Biden is finished. I couldn't be happier for the next phase.

  10. #7370
    Journeyman Teenwolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Thunder Bay, ON, CAN
    Posts
    3,097
    Quote Originally Posted by revo View Post
    Biden won 306-232. He leads by 6 million votes. Everyone doubted him. He held up his end of the bargain.
    I wish I was a political cartoonist. I have this image in my head of Joe Biden handcuffed in bondage gear with a ball gag in his mouth, Lindsay Graham standing over Biden with a feather saying "what's the safeword?" and Biden's eyes rolling back in his head in pure ecstasy.

    Losing down-ballot wasn't "part of the bargain." I think if you told Democratic voters they had to fight really hard for Biden to win by just enough to not be able to do anything other than work with Republicans to pass Republican priorities, they'd call that a raw deal.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •