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Thread: Election 2020

  1. #2971
    Hall of Famer B-Fly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teenwolf View Post
    Yeah, the question is whether you think voters will be more drawn to the wonky difficult to decipher white paper approach, or something easy to understand like the way Sanders describes Medicare for All.

    I would say poetry implies something fantastical whereas prose implies serious thinking. I think Warren's funding proposal is much more fantastical in its attempt to avoid taxation to pay for the plan, whereas Sanders' plan is more pragmatic and serious. So far, voters consistently trust Sanders more on health care than Warren. I don't think that will change.
    That's not what I mean when I speak of poetry vs. prose as an analogy. I think of poetry as inspiration and themes and broad outlines and prose as the nitty-gritty details. Both are super important and I didn't intend to denigrate either one.

  2. #2972
    All Star Sour Masher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teenwolf View Post
    Yeah, the question is whether you think voters will be more drawn to the wonky difficult to decipher white paper approach, or something easy to understand like the way Sanders describes Medicare for All.

    I would say poetry implies something fantastical whereas prose implies serious thinking. I think Warren's funding proposal is much more fantastical in its attempt to avoid taxation to pay for the plan, whereas Sanders' plan is more pragmatic and serious. So far, voters consistently trust Sanders more on health care than Warren. I don't think that will change.
    Sanders' plan is more straight forward and honest in its taxation, but it isn't going to be more popular. Both candidates face an uphill battle on this issue. I still think you have a skewed vision of American voters' political ideology, perhaps because of how much progressive media you consume. Yes, there are many people, especially younger people, who are willing to go as far as Sanders in State run everything (most of my students lean that way), but most older Americans are still wary of it. That include those like me who want to embrace it on moral grounds, but can't help acknowledge that the Sanders path, for all its noble intentions, is basically the textbook first step toward Marxism, and it nor any of its iterations has ever worked even remotely close as well as capitalism, with all its amorality and flaws.

    That is why, personally, I am more drawn to Warren, because she wants many of the same things, but ideologically wants them under a system of empathetic and regulated capitalism. And even there, and even on the one issue where I agree with state control--health care, because I believe it should be a basic human right--she faces tremendous headwinds. And I get it. It is going to cost a fortune, and many are wary that for all that cost, it still might not be better than a more moderate plan that gives state run healthcare to those currently not covered while letting those currently covered keep what they have. I, like you, want people suffering and in need of care to get it. I think most people want that. I am willing to even pay for it, but I find many who are actually making money, as opposed to my students, do not.

    That includes folks like my wife (who does like Mayor Pete, btw) and her parents, who are black--from Jamaica, specifically. Her parents are the hardest working people I know. They came from abject poverty and after decades of hard work, have earned a nice life. They are not looking to pay more taxes for a government run system. My father-in-law especially bristles at Sanders' calls for "free" everything. His progressivism extends so far as to want to ensure health coverage to every child, disabled person, and elderly person. But he doesn't want free anything for able bodied adults. He doesn't want to pay toward a system that supports able bodied adults that he thinks work less than him. He doesn't want state control of everything. And he isn't alone in America, or the black community. I've said before, if the GOP wasn't so racist, wasn't so openly antagonistic to minorities and immigrants, was more moderate, on the whole, it would draw so many more minorities into its tent than it does now. That is why, long term, I think the move to Trumpism will be catastrophic for the party. Demographics are changing, and the sharp turn to the right, and the alt-right, are going to sink the GOP long term.

  3. #2973
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sour Masher View Post
    Sanders' plan is more straight forward and honest in its taxation, but it isn't going to be more popular. Both candidates face an uphill battle on this issue. I still think you have a skewed vision of American voters' political ideology, perhaps because of how much progressive media you consume. Yes, there are many people, especially younger people, who are willing to go as far as Sanders in State run everything (most of my students lean that way), but most older Americans are still wary of it. That include those like me who want to embrace it on moral grounds, but can't help acknowledge that the Sanders path, for all its noble intentions, is basically the textbook first step toward Marxism, and it nor any of its iterations has ever worked even remotely close as well as capitalism, with all its amorality and flaws.

    That is why, personally, I am more drawn to Warren, because she wants many of the same things, but ideologically wants them under a system of empathetic and regulated capitalism. And even there, and even on the one issue where I agree with state control--health care, because I believe it should be a basic human right--she faces tremendous headwinds. And I get it. It is going to cost a fortune, and many are wary that for all that cost, it still might not be better than a more moderate plan that gives state run healthcare to those currently not covered while letting those currently covered keep what they have. I, like you, want people suffering and in need of care to get it. I think most people want that. I am willing to even pay for it, but I find many who are actually making money, as opposed to my students, do not.

    That includes folks like my wife (who does like Mayor Pete, btw) and her parents, who are black--from Jamaica, specifically. Her parents are the hardest working people I know. They came from abject poverty and after decades of hard work, have earned a nice life. They are not looking to pay more taxes for a government run system. My father-in-law especially bristles at Sanders' calls for "free" everything. His progressivism extends so far as to want to ensure health coverage to every child, disabled person, and elderly person. But he doesn't want free anything for able bodied adults. He doesn't want to pay toward a system that supports able bodied adults that he thinks work less than him. He doesn't want state control of everything. And he isn't alone in America, or the black community. I've said before, if the GOP wasn't so racist, wasn't so openly antagonistic to minorities and immigrants, was more moderate, on the whole, it would draw so many more minorities into its tent than it does now. That is why, long term, I think the move to Trumpism will be catastrophic for the party. Demographics are changing, and the sharp turn to the right, and the alt-right, are going to sink the GOP long term.
    Maybe your father-in-law should run for office. Sounds like I would vote for him.

  4. #2974
    All Star Sour Masher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nots View Post
    Maybe your father-in-law should run for office. Sounds like I would vote for him.
    Ha, he is a good dude. Wish I had a dad like him growing up. He supported Bennett, but he is obviously dead in the water.

  5. #2975
    Journeyman Kevin Seitzer's Avatar
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    I thought this was an interesting interview/forum with Biden on our foreign policy with respect to Russia:



    It's an hour long, but I felt I left it knowing Biden a lot better.
    "Jesus said to them, 'Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are going into the kingdom of God ahead of you.'"

  6. #2976
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    Rep. Peter King, who represents Nassau County on Long Island, becomes the 20th GOP rep to announce they're not seeking re-election. But he is in a district that is trending more Democratic, and despite having been in Congress since 1993, he beat a very little known Democratic challenger by just 6% in 2018.
    https://www.nydailynews.com/news/pol...-a336mhrprzUwM

  7. #2977
    Welcome to the Big Leagues, Kid Teenwolf's Avatar
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    Elizabeth Warren consistently fails when faced with tough questions. Her answer this weekend regarding the voting order of the primary states was particularly revealing. She acted annoyed at having to answer a tough question, and her ultimate response "I'm just a player in the game" sure doesn't sound like someone out to enact big structural change.

    This commentary analyzes Warren's problems with answering tough questions, and "needing to get an A".


  8. #2978
    All Star Sour Masher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teenwolf View Post
    Elizabeth Warren consistently fails when faced with tough questions. Her answer this weekend regarding the voting order of the primary states was particularly revealing. She acted annoyed at having to answer a tough question, and her ultimate response "I'm just a player in the game" sure doesn't sound like someone out to enact big structural change.

    This commentary analyzes Warren's problems with answering tough questions, and "needing to get an A".

    The compilation doesn't make her look great. It clearly has an agenda of doing so as well, though. I suspect you could do this with any of the candidates, although, I admit, Bernie is in a constant state of agitation, so he probably wouldn't get caught getting flustered/agitated at a question . I kid, I kid. He answers tough questions head on more than most. But I'd bet you could find some fumbles even from him.

  9. #2979
    All Star Mithrandir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teenwolf View Post
    Elizabeth Warren consistently fails when faced with tough questions. Her answer this weekend regarding the voting order of the primary states was particularly revealing. She acted annoyed at having to answer a tough question, and her ultimate response "I'm just a player in the game" sure doesn't sound like someone out to enact big structural change.

    This commentary analyzes Warren's problems with answering tough questions, and "needing to get an A".

    "Krystal Ball" Nice. At least her parents had a sense of humor!
    "I lingered round them, under that benign sky: watched the moths fluttering among the heath and harebells, listened to the soft wind breathing through the grass, and wondered how any one could ever imagine unquiet slumbers for the sleepers in that quiet earth."

  10. #2980
    Welcome to the Big Leagues, Kid Teenwolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mithrandir View Post
    "Krystal Ball" Nice. At least her parents had a sense of humor!
    I find her commentary quite prophetic.

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