Election 2020

[Teenwolf]

TW said earlier in this thread that Biden’s discussion of busing — in the mid 1970s — should have disqualified him from running.

Now, stuff that was said 40 years ago is no longer important.

I'm not interested in Biden's ancient history right now. I dont have the time or the interest to reanimate year old arguments.

I'm asking you to confront the reality that Biden is showing visible mental decline, and that disqualifies him from the Presidency. It's so blatantly obvious. The man looks LOST. He stopped himself at the debate, in the middle of a rant, and asked himself "I just stopped myself. Why did I do that? Nobody else is stopping." Even Joe himself is surprised at his inability to complete a thought.

If Bernie claimed he was arrested in South Africa when he wasn't, if he claimed he was running for the Senate, and said "vote for the other Sanders", you think these signs of mental decline would be ignored? Further, you think these signs of decline aren't disqualifying? Or do you continue to refuse to admit Biden is mentally declining?

[The Feral Slasher]

Anyone watch the debate? I misses it but it sounds like Bloomberg may have had a friendly crowd. Reports i have seen are that tickets were 1000 to 3000 bucks.

[The Feral Slasher]

Anyone watch the debate? I misses it but it sounds like Bloomberg may have had a friendly crowd. Reports i have seen are that tickets were 1000 to 3000 bucks.

The kindest reviews i saw called it a disaster.

[B-Fly]

I did not. I meant as horrible as bloomberg is, he would have less horrible policies than Trump. But it seems we all agree, we do not want bloomberg as the nominee. Might be the only thing we all agree on .

On science/environment, guns and court appointments alone, he'd be 100x better than Trump. I honestly don't remotely understand or accept the argument that he'd be worse.

That said, I too agree that he should not be the Democratic Party nominee.

[swampdragon]

I think this is a great idea

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/25/o...andidates.html

excerpt below

What would this super ticket look like? Well, I suggest Sanders — and Michael Bloomberg, who seems to be his most viable long-term challenger — lay it out this way:

“I want people to know that if I am the Democratic nominee these will be my cabinet choices — my team of rivals. I want Amy Klobuchar as my vice president. Her decency, experience and moderation will be greatly appreciated across America and particularly in the Midwest. I want Mike Bloomberg (or Bernie Sanders) as my secretary of the Treasury. Our plans for addressing income inequality are actually not that far apart, and if we can blend them together it will be great for the country and reassure markets. I want Joe Biden as my secretary of state. No one in our party knows the world better or has more credibility with our allies than Joe. I will ask Elizabeth Warren to serve as health and human services secretary. No one could bring more energy and intellect to the task of expanding health care for more Americans than Senator Warren.

“I want Kamala Harris for attorney general. She has the toughness and integrity needed to clean up the corrupt mess Donald Trump has created in our Justice Department. I would like Mayor Pete as homeland security secretary; his intelligence and military background would make him a quick study in that job. I would like Tom Steyer to head a new cabinet position: secretary of national infrastructure. We’re going to rebuild America, not just build a wall on the border with Mexico. And I am asking Cory Booker, the former mayor of Newark, to become secretary of housing and urban development. Who would bring more passion to the task of revitalizing our inner cities than Cory?...

[B-Fly]

I've said it a million times, if the HRC crowd doesn't fully back whomever is Trumps opponent, they deserve 4 more years of Trump.

I see Trump Voters/supporters as one entity and am not counting on then in any way.

Sanders path to the White House is this simple--Get the Nomination--Then, Hold the Election. I believe if the Democrats vote party line he wins. They will have every vote HRC did least time PLUS all the Sanders base (which will have SOOO many more folks this time around) I don't believe he really has to do anything but be himself and we, his supporters stay the course. BTW, I think were talking past each other regarding the definition of educated people--I see Intellectuals as naturally smart AND educated people. Then there's those of avg Intel who are educated and WANT to know things. Those who are of avg Intel and willfully ignorant--do not matter in the machinations of getting Sanders elected and stupid people, well they're already voting for Trump

I'm not sure I buy this analysis of the Sanders path to the White House. I think there is a Sanders path to the White House, but strategically I think it has to be acknowledged that Hillary Clinton had a different voter demographic than Sanders would or even than Obama had. I specifically know quite a number of people who voted for George W Bush, McCain, Romney and then Hillary Clinton. Those people tend to be foreign policy neoconservatives who are moderate to liberal across economic and social issues, but also included a number of financial markets watchers who trusted Clinton more than Trump to be stabilizing and pro-market, given Trump's populism.

Sanders is going to lose a lot of those voters, who could either flip to Trump, vote third party or stay home. It's foolish to presume otherwise. But...

I think he can make up for it and then some with other voters who either voted third-party, stayed home, or who voted for Trump because they believed Hillary Clinton and/or the "Washington establishment" to be too corrupt or dishonest, including too beholden to the military industrial complex and/or Wall Street. Within this mix are voters out who chose Obama over McCain and/or Romney and then Trump over Clinton. I think some of them hoped and believed Trump's policies wouldn't be so … Republican; hoped and believed Trump's insistence that he would be looking out for hardworking "real Americans" and who are now struggling just as badly or worse with stagnant wages, inadequate or too expensive health insurance, college debt, etc, who could switch their vote from Trump in 2016 to Sanders in 2020.

All of those potential swing voters are at the margins in one way or another. The vast majority of American voters will vote Blue No Matter Who or Red No Matter Who in presidential elections. But given the margins of victory for Trump in Michigan, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania, those small groups of voters/potential voters can and likely will make all the difference.

[revo]

I'm not interested in Biden's ancient history right now. I dont have the time or the interest to reanimate year old arguments.

I'm asking you to confront the reality that Biden is showing visible mental decline, and that disqualifies him from the Presidency. It's so blatantly obvious. The man looks LOST. He stopped himself at the debate, in the middle of a rant, and asked himself "I just stopped myself. Why did I do that? Nobody else is stopping." Even Joe himself is surprised at his inability to complete a thought.

If Bernie claimed he was arrested in South Africa when he wasn't, if he claimed he was running for the Senate, and said "vote for the other Sanders", you think these signs of mental decline would be ignored? Further, you think these signs of decline aren't disqualifying? Or do you continue to refuse to admit Biden is mentally declining?

Did you actually watch the debate? Biden was fine. That line you're highlighting was a joke he made. He had one instance of a mental screwup, and it most certainly wasn't that. Otherwise, he was on his game, he was angry, he was forceful, he was funny.

Dude, your guy's heart nearly exploded a few months ago. He's almost 79 years old. That's what happens when you're as old as that, your body starts to break down. He went to HS with my dad, who's gone now over 13 years. Bernie and Biden are both geezers. There's no way either can serve two terms. So please, get off the "there's no alternative to Bernie" train. If he's the nominee, I'll vote for him over the schmuck in office, but I'll hold my nose while doing it.

[gcstomp]

I watched debate, and Biden looked good. He stopped himself in the middle of an answer and asked himself why did he stop, because he was following the clock. And he expressed like 6 times during the debate frustration of others not following clock and talking over their times and he was following debate rules and he pointed out several different ways this very very obvious issue. He wasnt lost. Biden had his best debate though I have to say the likable uncle Joe was replaced by an angry and forceful dude but that is understandable as it may be too little too late and Biden is showing frustration.

The night was a mosh pit, and Biden was pointing out he was adhering to debate rules and everyone else was seizing time and jumping in at will. It would be near impossible for anyone who watched debate to come to a different conclusion.

[nullnor]

I think this is a great idea

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/25/o...andidates.html

excerpt below

What would this super ticket look like? Well, I suggest Sanders — and Michael Bloomberg, who seems to be his most viable long-term challenger — lay it out this way:

“I want people to know that if I am the Democratic nominee these will be my cabinet choices — my team of rivals. I want Amy Klobuchar as my vice president. Her decency, experience and moderation will be greatly appreciated across America and particularly in the Midwest. I want Mike Bloomberg (or Bernie Sanders) as my secretary of the Treasury. Our plans for addressing income inequality are actually not that far apart, and if we can blend them together it will be great for the country and reassure markets. I want Joe Biden as my secretary of state. No one in our party knows the world better or has more credibility with our allies than Joe. I will ask Elizabeth Warren to serve as health and human services secretary. No one could bring more energy and intellect to the task of expanding health care for more Americans than Senator Warren.

“I want Kamala Harris for attorney general. She has the toughness and integrity needed to clean up the corrupt mess Donald Trump has created in our Justice Department. I would like Mayor Pete as homeland security secretary; his intelligence and military background would make him a quick study in that job. I would like Tom Steyer to head a new cabinet position: secretary of national infrastructure. We’re going to rebuild America, not just build a wall on the border with Mexico. And I am asking Cory Booker, the former mayor of Newark, to become secretary of housing and urban development. Who would bring more passion to the task of revitalizing our inner cities than Cory?...

isn't better to be a Senator? secretary of state is good. Biden could probably do that. ..i am also starting to think Biden probably didn't contribute anything to Obama when he was president. one of the things funny about Obama was the probably rare times he got pissed off. even at little things. i bet Biden fucked up a lot in the WH and Obama didn't advertise it.

if you win the presidency you gotta be cut throat. you choose you're own fucking vice president. no compromise. because you earned it.

[TranaGreg]

...
I'm asking you to confront the reality that Biden is showing visible mental decline, and that disqualifies him from the Presidency. It's so blatantly obvious. The man looks LOST. He stopped himself at the debate, in the middle of a rant, and asked himself "I just stopped myself. Why did I do that? Nobody else is stopping." Even Joe himself is surprised at his inability to complete a thought.
...

FWIW, I watched about 15 mins of the debate so I may not have all the context, but I did see this bit. My reaction was that this was a comment by someone who was really frustrated by the chaotic nature of the debate to that point, so he was editorializing out loud about the unfair nature of it ... I didn't think of it as a sign of anything more than that.

[DMT]

Claiming that that exchange means Biden is mentally unfit because says more about the claimant than it does about Biden.

Of course, TW will lash out at me and claim I only made personal attacks against him, but perhaps at some point he'll wake up and see it's not just me.

[Sour Masher]

Claiming that that exchange means Biden is mentally unfit because says more about the claimant than it does about Biden.

I think it means the claimant did not watch the exchange in context, but saw someone else highlight it as evidence for a pre-existing theory and used it inappropriately, reaffirming a long held bias against Biden, and perhaps hurting his ethos.

However, I do think, independent of this exchange, there is evidence that Biden has what polite society sometimes calls senior moments. I have beaten this horse to death--I think I am more concerned about the advanced ages of the three male front-runners more than anyone here--electing someone to what is intended, at minimum, to be a four year position that is more than a decade past the normal retirement age is scary for lots of reasons. Sanders' heart scares me (those who have had a heart attack are more likely to have another). Biden's mind scares me. These things we have seen from Biden may be rare and fleeting now, but they are likely to get worse and more frequent over the next half decade.

[DMT]

Can you imagine having a camera following you 24/7? Everyone is going to have slip-ups. Focusing on each one of Biden's as if it's the final proof that he is mentally incompetent is just idiotic.

Trump can't read FFS and we're worried about Biden's mental state?

[In the Corn]

I thought I was the only one who took candidates words out of context.

Perhaps, Biden was trying to be nuanced.

[Ken]

Can you imagine having a camera following you 24/7? Everyone is going to have slip-ups.

That bed camera is the one that really gives you nightmares