What “I” stand for/ want!

[Bernie Brewer]

Universal health care. That would be # 1, and financially it makes more sense than current system, where more is spent per person on health care than any other nation on earth including all the industrialized nations that have universal coverage, but so many here are without coverage. Also, k-12 teachers need a raise, and budgets restored so that schools can again offer art, home ec, music, autoshop, drama, gym. That "fluff" is the stuff that provides enrichment, motivation, resulting in higher grad rates and well rounded students eager to tackle rest of life.

I agree completely. We’ve argued about ACA before and I think it doesn’t go far enough. There should never be an option for insurance companies to deny someone for pre-existing conditions. True universal healthcare is absolutely needed. And, Teachers are way underpaid and therefore undervalued. We need tech training in high schools again and to me music programs are essentially like teaching a language. Look at this, for two Guys so far apart, we really aren’t. I agree with SM that we should reduce military spending to pay for much of this. Where we differ I suspect is immigration. I want DACA passed as law. But we need better border control.

[hacko]

I agree completely. We’ve argued about ACA before and I think it doesn’t go far enough. There should never be an option for insurance companies to deny someone for pre-existing conditions. True universal healthcare is absolutely needed. And, Teachers are way underpaid and therefore undervalued. We need tech training in high schools again and to me music programs are essentially like teaching a language. Look at this, for two Guys so far apart, we really aren’t. I agree with SM that we should reduce military spending to pay for much of this. Where we differ I suspect is immigration. I want DACA passed as law. But we need better border control.

See as long as we keep Trump,Republican,and Democrat words out of this thread and just keep it to want I want we will see we have more in common then we think. I have no problem with better border control I just don’t think we need to spend billions on a wall .
I saw a piece last week that one of the last messages Reagan left was to talk about as a country we have to be open to welcoming immigrants and if we stop that we will die as a nation.

[DMT]

See as long as we keep Trump,Republican,and Democrat words out of this thread and just keep it to want I want we will see we have more in common then we think. I have no problem with better border control I just don’t think we need to spend billions on a wall .
I saw a piece last week that one of the last messages Reagan left was to talk about as a country we have to be open to welcoming immigrants and if we stop that we will die as a nation.

As descendants, all of us fit into one of four categories: Native Americans, immigrants, slaves, or refugees.

[Sour Masher]

I agree completely. We’ve argued about ACA before and I think it doesn’t go far enough. There should never be an option for insurance companies to deny someone for pre-existing conditions. True universal healthcare is absolutely needed. And, Teachers are way underpaid and therefore undervalued. We need tech training in high schools again and to me music programs are essentially like teaching a language. Look at this, for two Guys so far apart, we really aren’t. I agree with SM that we should reduce military spending to pay for much of this. Where we differ I suspect is immigration. I want DACA passed as law. But we need better border control.

I don't think we are all that far on immigration either. I agree with better border control, and a much better sense of who comes in and out of the country. We may disagree on how many people we give the opportunity to visit and/or stay and become citizens, and where those folks come from. For instance, I do not believe we should be restricting law-abiding migrant workers from coming here, or for students (it has become a lot harder for international students to stay here under Trump; I've seen it first hand at my university, especially from predominantly Muslim countries) . I don't think race, religion, creed, or affluence should be determining factors for entry. But I do agree, we need to know who comes and goes, and a better job of stopping criminals and nefarious people from entering on the sly.

[cardboardbox]

I agree completely. We’ve argued about ACA before and I think it doesn’t go far enough. There should never be an option for insurance companies to deny someone for pre-existing conditions.

Is there a legal way right now for insurance companies to do this?

And, Teachers are way underpaid and therefore undervalued.

how much should they be paid?

[Sour Masher]

Is there a legal way right now for insurance companies to do this?

how much should they be paid?

One way to look at this/think about this is in relation to average salary by degree. If you compare teacher salaries to salaries of those with BAs, MAs, professional degrees, PhDs as a whole, it is way, way lower. Now, that is somewhat mitigated by the 10 month school year (I know kids are out longer, but teachers still are on the clock, prepping and such). But even when that is accounted for, teachers make much less than others who spend the time and money getting college degrees. So, moving average salaries closer to the overall averages is a good mark/goal to me.

[Bernie Brewer]

I don't think we are all that far on immigration either. I agree with better border control, and a much better sense of who comes in and out of the country. We may disagree on how many people we give the opportunity to visit and/or stay and become citizens, and where those folks come from. For instance, I do not believe we should be restricting law-abiding migrant workers from coming here, or for students (it has become a lot harder for international students to stay here under Trump; I've seen it first hand at my university, especially from predominantly Muslim countries) . I don't think race, religion, creed, or affluence should be determining factors for entry. But I do agree, we need to know who comes and goes, and a better job of stopping criminals and nefarious people from entering on the sly.

Look there. 100%. I think you or B Fly (and probably many others) said that despite our passionate disagreements, we all likely agree on 90% of the issues, maybe even more. The problem is how we interpret each other. It’s like when I tried to explain with the concept of “legal votes.” We all agree all legal votes should be counted. But where we begin to disagree is defining what is a legal vote. Not to get off the thread topic, if we could converse in a manner where both parties aren't essentially trying to stack the deck in their favor, we would have less gerrymandering and confusion on what votes should be counted.

[Bernie Brewer]

Is there a legal way right now for insurance companies to do this?

how much should they be paid?

Insurance companies can’t deny coverage, in most instances, for pre-existing conditions. But there is so much disagreement about ACA that if the Republicans were ever successful in turning it over, this could be back on the table. It never, ever, ever should be.

As for teachers, that’s an excellent question. There are some school districts here in Illinois they pay their teachers incredibly well, while others pay very poorly. Many would argue that the problem with the Chicago public schools, where I live, is that, while they have some great teachers who are doing the noble thing and foregoing the compensation, they should not have to make that choice. Many of the best teachers choose to work in the suburban school districts where pay is better, as are working conditions. That’s unfair to inter-city kids and furthers the repeating ugly cycle of high dropout rates, poor test scores, and no secondary education.

[nots]

All of these suggestions take money....large sums of it. Haven’t seen any proposals on how to pay for it outside of taxing pot and the traditional ‘cut military spending’, which I believe is a pipe dream (though I have long been a proponent of it). I’m sure you could wrestle up 50-75 votes in the House to cut funding from folks that run uncontested or against nominal opposition, but finding the rest is unlikely. Forget the GOP, what Democrat from a swing district is going to vote to substantially cut military spending and then get primaried and/or beaten over the head with that vote in a general election? Once Kerry got swiftboated, the calculus changed. You might be able to cut a few $ at the margins (mostly because Trump has gone so far overboard on military spending), but you are certainly not funding all the programs suggested here.

[cardboardbox]

One way to look at this/think about this is in relation to average salary by degree. If you compare teacher salaries to salaries of those with BAs, MAs, professional degrees, PhDs as a whole, it is way, way lower. Now, that is somewhat mitigated by the 10 month school year (I know kids are out longer, but teachers still are on the clock, prepping and such). But even when that is accounted for, teachers make much less than others who spend the time and money getting college degrees. So, moving average salaries closer to the overall averages is a good mark/goal to me.

Maybe the higher educated teachers need more pay but I know teachers who had no training or schooling to teach, they just had a degree in a related field, and they hopped right in to teaching at 55k/yr. Thats probably chump change in NY but around here you can live decently on that and if your spouse does the same thing, 110k/yr around here is plenty to live on. 9 weeks off in the summer, 1 for thx, 2 for winter, 1 for spring break, + some minor holidays here and there that no one outside of govt gets. I think thats awesome... even the hours are pretty good. Its just dealing with the students that would drive me insane I think.

edit to say, 55k for a family of 4 is pretty tight here. I was thinking for a single person.

[cardboardbox]

Insurance companies can’t deny coverage, in most instances, for pre-existing conditions. But there So much disagreement about ACA that if the Republicans forever successful in turning it over, this could be back on the table. It never ever ever should be.

The repubs and Trump tried to change ACA but their bill didnt deny coverage due to pre-existing conditions either.

[Bernie Brewer]

One way to look at this/think about this is in relation to average salary by degree. If you compare teacher salaries to salaries of those with BAs, MAs, professional degrees, PhDs as a whole, it is way, way lower. Now, that is somewhat mitigated by the 10 month school year (I know kids are out longer, but teachers still are on the clock, prepping and such). But even when that is accounted for, teachers make much less than others who spend the time and money getting college degrees. So, moving average salaries closer to the overall averages is a good mark/goal to me.

Excellent points. When I go to work every day I don’t have to bring my own supplies, they are provided for me. If a customer comes in he needs a deposit slip or a withdrawal notice, there are there available for the taking. Unfortunately, many teachers are forced to spend personal money to provide badly needed supplies just to give the kids a fighting chance. That is absolutely ridiculous of my mind. My daughter-in-law works as a third-grade teacher in an inner-city school in a good size city in downstate Illinois. Many of the kids come from poor, broken, unstable families or home environments and she on occasion buys them basic essentials, like mittens or socks. Heartbreaking.

[cardboardbox]

My daughter-in-law works as a third-grade teacher in an inner-city school in downstate Illinois. Many of the kids come from poor, broken, unstable families or home environments and she on occasion buys them mittens or socks. Heartbreaking.

give her a hug!

[Bernie Brewer]

give her a hug!

I wish I knew how to attach a picture, because she had one little girl in her class last year, who apparently lives with an extended family member, who wrote her the most beautiful letter. As good as an 8 to 9 year old could write, She told her that she was all she was the only person she could look up to and wanted to be a teacher when she is older. It made me cry.

[Sour Masher]

Maybe the higher educated teachers need more pay but I know teachers who had no training or schooling to teach, they just had a degree in a related field, and they hopped right in to teaching at 55k/yr. Thats probably chump change in NY but around here you can live decently on that and if your spouse does the same thing, 110k/yr around here is plenty to live on. 9 weeks off in the summer, 1 for thx, 2 for winter, 1 for spring break, + some minor holidays here and there that no one outside of govt gets. I think thats awesome... even the hours are pretty good. Its just dealing with the students that would drive me insane I think.

edit to say, 55k for a family of 4 is pretty tight here. I was thinking for a single person.

A starting salary of 55K for a k-12 teacher is way, way above average. As BB pointed out, there are exceptions, and some areas do pay teachers well, but if you look at averages, that 55k starting figure for an out of field teacher is super high end--it is above every state average, including Cali and NY and NJ. In fact, Jersey is the only state with a starting salary of 50k. Where is that? Maybe I'll move there .

ETA: Average starting salary for a teacher nationally is $38,617, which ain't bad when comparing to everyone, overall, but way lower than the starting salary for other college grads, who start out at $50,390. In the board game of Life, spending those years and dollars getting those degrees set you back big time. To make it worth it, you have to make a lot more than those who don't get those degrees, or why bother getting the degrees?