Robert Mueller investigation

[Judge Jude]

imagine the "possible side effects"

the old SNL of years ago had enough of a sense of humor to do it. but those days are gone, I fear.

I mean, on Obama's last weekend as President they unironically did a group "To Sir With Love" song/fellation.

and this was SNL's remake of the "All I Want for Christmas" song in December re the Mueller report:

"This needs to be done by Christmas/I need a frickin' ounce of cheer/I just really want my life back/Oh, my God, it's been two years."

"I don't need a full impeachment/But we just need a little fun/Please just tell us we aren't crazy/At least indict his oldest son."

"Mueller, please come through/Because our only other option is a coup."

.....................

The Art of War teachings are lost on an entire generation.

[Kevin Seitzer]

And I would humbly point out that we still don't know what Mueller found.

[The Feral Slasher]

And I would humbly point out that we still don't know what Mueller found.

true, we haven't seen the whole report. but Barring (lol) a surprise things aren't looking good for the trump=puppet side. But I'm not getting my hopes up or thinking that anything more is going to come out of this. Time will tell as always

[Judge Jude]

And I would humbly point out that we still don't know what Mueller found.

I don't know if "humble" is the word to describe reactions that don't acknowledge that Mueller says in the letter - that otherwise mostly is Barr's analysis - that after interviewing literally 500 people that he could not establish that anyone in the Trump campaign colluded with the Russian government on some alleged election-fixing effort.

That report - and 1,000 investigations - easily could find egregious, unethical, and even impeachable offenses by the guy. would not surprise me.

but the tight knuckles on "Trump is a Putin puppet" part, I don't get. I hope that's not in your, well, basket.

[B-Fly]

On a little more serious note - shouldn't some people re-assess the strategy of "the resistance" ? So far anything that is negative about Trump has been accepted and promoted. Shouldn't people opposed to Trump focus on what is real and horrible about him rather than the easy choice of buying into rumors and anything negative that someone wants to say about him ? I sure hope whoever wins the Dem nomination focuses on policy and not all the other crap.

Not sure "the resistance" has been anything more than a rallying cry for disparate individuals and loosely-affiliated groups, from the grassroots to the institutional, to oppose the Trump Administration broadly and on pretty much all fronts. It's similar to, but less organized and controlled than, the McConnell-led GOP opposition to the Obama Administration. And many of the people I know who would count themselves as part of "the resistance", have overwhelmingly focused their efforts and energies on "real and horrible" matters of policy, e.g., opposition to the Trump Administration's immigration/travel policies, opposition to its multiple attempts to murder the ACA, opposition to its Supreme Court and lower court appointments, opposition to the deliberate efforts to demonize and sow distrust toward and conspiracy theories about (fill in the blank, e.g., the media, the Deep State, the Fed, "higher education", undocumented immigrant uber-predators).

[The Feral Slasher]

Not sure "the resistance" has been anything more than a rallying cry for disparate individuals and loosely-affiliated groups, from the grassroots to the institutional, to oppose the Trump Administration broadly and on pretty much all fronts. It's similar to, but less organized and controlled than, the McConnell-led GOP opposition to the Obama Administration. And many of the people I know who would count themselves as part of "the resistance", have overwhelmingly focused their efforts and energies on "real and horrible" matters of policy, e.g., opposition to the Trump Administration's immigration/travel policies, opposition to its multiple attempts to murder the ACA, opposition to its Supreme Court and lower court appointments, opposition to the deliberate efforts to demonize and sow distrust toward and conspiracy theories about (fill in the blank, e.g., the media, the Deep State, the Fed, "higher education", undocumented immigrant uber-predators).

My terminology was not precise. And I certainly did not mean to imply that there aren't people that oppose Trump's policies. My exposure to "the resistance" was mostly online and I associated it, wrongly or rightly, with those who were focusing on Russia, impeachment, twitter etc. Anyway, it's good that there are people who are focusing on policy, and apologies for my poor choice of wording.

[Kevin Seitzer]

I don't know if "humble" is the word to describe reactions that don't acknowledge that Mueller says in the letter - that otherwise mostly is Barr's analysis - that after interviewing literally 500 people that he could not establish that anyone in the Trump campaign colluded with the Russian government on some alleged election-fixing effort.

That report - and 1,000 investigations - easily could find egregious, unethical, and even impeachable offenses by the guy. would not surprise me.

but the tight knuckles on "Trump is a Putin puppet" part, I don't get. I hope that's not in your, well, basket.

I don't think I've given any evidence on here advocating for the "Trump is a Putin puppet" position, so I'm not sure why you bring that out. I don't trust an attorney general, who was appointed specifically because Trump believed he would cover up whatever negative things Mueller found, to be transparent about what Mueller found and not to selectively take things out of context from his report. I'm awaiting seeing his actual report. I don't consider Barr's summary of it and slant on it to be worth very much.

The facts we have are that Mueller did not indict Don Jr, likely meaning, although I don't know for sure, that he doesn't have anything rising to the level of proof that would stand up in a trial that the Trump Tower meeting with the Russians was part of a criminal conspiracy. What level he has short of criminal proof I don't know, and I would be interested to know. The fact that he didn't indict Trump himself doesn't mean anything because he never was going to be able, by rule, to indict Trump.

Barr's statement/summary on the obstruction of justice angle was much more mixed, which makes me wonder what Mueller found there.

I'm not advocating for any position here. I'm just saying that as much as you are trumpeting now that the media jumped to conclusions about what Mueller would find, I wonder if you are jumping to conclusions ahead of actually seeing the Mueller report. Maybe we should just wait and see and draw our conclusions once we've seen it?

[Kevin Seitzer]

I also don't really care about whether this is a winning campaign issue for the Democrats or not. For me that was never what this was about. I know it was for some people, but not for me. I just want to know what Mueller found. If he really found nothing, I will be, as I stated earlier in this thread, very relieved.

[Judge Jude]

"I wonder if you are jumping to conclusions ahead of actually seeing the Mueller report. Maybe we should just wait and see and draw our conclusions once we've seen it?"

I believe Barr and Mueller have known each other for 30 years, and both are highly respected in DC legal circles.
On evidence of Trump's people colluding with the Russian government to try to rig the election - Mueller didn't find it, and if he did he wouldn't be silent today.

as far as anything else that is found, yes let's wait and see.
but those are two very different things.

it's clinging to the "Trump is a Putin puppet" angle that I find bizarre, at this point. if that's not you, then it's not you.

[DMT]

"I wonder if you are jumping to conclusions ahead of actually seeing the Mueller report. Maybe we should just wait and see and draw our conclusions once we've seen it?"

I believe Barr and Mueller have known each other for 30 years, and both are highly respected in DC legal circles.
On evidence of Trump's people colluding with the Russian government to try to rig the election - Mueller didn't find it, and if he did he wouldn't be silent today.

as far as anything else that is found, yes let's wait and see.
but those are two very different things.

it's clinging to the "Trump is a Putin puppet" angle that I find bizarre, at this point. if that's not you, then it's not you.

Who here is clinging to the "Trump is a Putin puppet" angle?

[TS Garp]

Who here is clinging to the "Trump is a Putin puppet" angle?

Exactly. It's like debating with the Riddler.

[DMT]

Exactly. It's like debating with the Riddler.

It would be like us claiming JJ still believes Obama is a Kenyan Muslim.

[Kevin Seitzer]

On evidence of Trump's people colluding with the Russian government to try to rig the election - Mueller didn't find it, and if he did he wouldn't be silent today.

I thought he was legally required to be silent about what he put in his confidential report to the attorney general?

[swampdragon]

Who has read the entire Mueller report?

Officially? and Probably?

Barr - officially has read it - whether he read carefully the entire thing is up to interpretation but officially he has read it.

Who else?

[The Feral Slasher]

Who has read the entire Mueller report?

Officially? and Probably?

Barr - officially has read it - whether he read carefully the entire thing is up to interpretation but officially he has read it.

Who else?

I doubt anyone here can answer the question. I'm curious what you are getting at -- or are you just curious as well ?