Economic, taxes, and tariffs discussion

[onejayhawk]

Nearly every economist, besides the one he found through AMAZON, also disagree. But you knew that. I guess on Bizarro J World they’re all in favor.

Disagree with what, exactly. And I do mean exactly.

J

[revo]

Disagree with what, exactly. And I do mean exactly.

J

Disagree that tariffs are a means to achieve a successful outcome.

[onejayhawk]

Disagree that tariffs are a means to achieve a successful outcome.

Ah. That is clearly a difference between you and the administration.

It's one that surprises me because, in the abstract, it's just another tool in the case. Why are tariffs in any way different from any other diplomatic/economic lever?

J

[revo]

Ah. That is clearly a difference between you and the administration.

It's one that surprises me because, in the abstract, it's just another tool in the case. Why are tariffs in any way different from any other diplomatic/economic lever?

J

Because it's American businesses who pay the tariffs on imports, which ultimately get passed down to the American people. So it's a tax on your own population. Tariffs start a chain of events within your own country, and usually backfire spectacularly.

[onejayhawk]

Because it's American businesses who pay the tariffs on imports, which ultimately get passed down to the American people. So it's a tax on your own population. Tariffs start a chain of events within your own country, and usually backfire spectacularly.

Tell China that. They won't believe you either.

J

[revo]

Tell China that. They won't believe you either.

J

I honestly have no idea what you're saying. Is it at all possible for you to speak straight-forwardly?

[onejayhawk]

I honestly have no idea what you're saying. Is it at all possible for you to speak straight-forwardly?

That is straight forward. China would not believe you if you tried to tell them that tariffs only hurt Americans. So, why do you tell us?

J

[revo]

That is straight forward. China would not believe you if you tried to tell them that tariffs only hurt Americans. So, why do you tell us?

J

Can you quote me on where I said tariffs ONLY hurt Americans? Let me re-post what I said:

"Because it's American businesses who pay the tariffs on imports, which ultimately get passed down to the American people. So it's a tax on your own population. Tariffs start a chain of events within your own country, and usually backfire spectacularly."

[onejayhawk]

Can you quote me on where I said tariffs ONLY hurt Americans? Let me re-post what I said:

"Because it's American businesses who pay the tariffs on imports, which ultimately get passed down to the American people. So it's a tax on your own population. Tariffs start a chain of events within your own country, and usually backfire spectacularly."

That's the one. I say again, tell it to the Chinese.

J

[Sour Masher]

That's the one. I say again, tell it to the Chinese.

J

Are you suggesting it is not possible that tarriffs in a trade war between the US and China cannot both hurt the Chinese people and the American people?

[nullnor]

hey look! a squirrel at a baseball game.

[onejayhawk]

Did he find any peanuts?

Are you suggesting it is not possible that tarriffs in a trade war between the US and China cannot both hurt the Chinese people and the American people?

No.

Are you really asking if the tariffs are hurting the American people more than the Chinese? If so, clearly not.

J

[revo]

Are you really asking if the tariffs are hurting the American people more than the Chinese? If so, clearly not.

J

The problem J, is that your conjecture is certainly not as clear-cut as you want to make it, which is why no one really bothers engaging you in any discourse here.

There are certainly American industries that got crushed by Trump's tariffs. We've paid out almost $8Bn in welfare to support our agriculture industries recently, as you've seem to have forgotten. Other industries, such as toys, cars, and manufacturing as a whole, have suffered because of his misguided approach.

These opinion articles feel the opposite to you:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/francescoppola/2018/09/18/president-trumps-tariffs-will-hurt-america-more-than-china/#48dc90886276

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2018-12-04/trump-s-embrace-of-tariffs-hurts-u-s-consumers-more-than-china

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/13/trump-trade-the-us-will-regret-when-tariffs-hurt-chinas-growth.html

https://thehill.com/opinion/finance/413180-trumps-tariffs-are-hurting-america

https://www.voanews.com/a/survey-us-tariffs-hurting-american-businesses-in-china-/4569915.html

Clearly some American industries are suffering. While it's not hitting the entire American economy that badly, we've always discussed here that the Chinese tariffs were targeted to Trump Country more than the coasts.

In any case, to say something like "clearly not" shows just how out of touch you are to the situation. To just use how their stock market is performing as the reasoning behind your argument is a very Trumpian exercise. His tariffs have done extensive damage to some industries, which may take them years to recover.

[revo]

This moron still does not understand how tariffs work or who pays them. It’s amazing to me that no one dares to correct him:

“China is paying us right now billions and billions of tariffs a month, I love it personally, I love it, but it's hurting them," Trump said and then recounted his fentanyl deal with Xi. Fentanyl is a substance that has been tied to an epidemic of overdose deaths in the United States, which has been a top priority issue for the Trump administration.”

China does not pay us anything in tariffs! Companies importing Chinese goods do! What a bozo.

[onejayhawk]

The problem J, is that your conjecture is certainly not as clear-cut as you want to make it, which is why no one really bothers engaging you in any discourse here.

There are certainly American industries that got crushed by Trump's tariffs. We've paid out almost $8Bn in welfare to support our agriculture industries recently, as you've seem to have forgotten. Other industries, such as toys, cars, and manufacturing as a whole, have suffered because of his misguided approach.

These opinion articles feel the opposite to you:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/francescoppola/2018/09/18/president-trumps-tariffs-will-hurt-america-more-than-china/#48dc90886276

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2018-12-04/trump-s-embrace-of-tariffs-hurts-u-s-consumers-more-than-china

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/13/trump-trade-the-us-will-regret-when-tariffs-hurt-chinas-growth.html

https://thehill.com/opinion/finance/413180-trumps-tariffs-are-hurting-america

https://www.voanews.com/a/survey-us-tariffs-hurting-american-businesses-in-china-/4569915.html

Clearly some American industries are suffering. While it's not hitting the entire American economy that badly, we've always discussed here that the Chinese tariffs were targeted to Trump Country more than the coasts.

In any case, to say something like "clearly not" shows just how out of touch you are to the situation. To just use how their stock market is performing as the reasoning behind your argument is a very Trumpian exercise. His tariffs have done extensive damage to some industries, which may take them years to recover.

It's not hard to find criticisms of Trump so I am unimpressed. He keeps scoring points in spite of the blowback. Among other things, people underestimate him.

I agree that tariffs are not clear cut. However, you have taken the position that they are always wrong. That's over the top, particularly if we are in a trade war.

This moron still does not understand how tariffs work or who pays them. It’s amazing to me that no one dares to correct him: “China is paying us right now billions and billions of tariffs a month, I love it personally, I love it, but it's hurting them," Trump said”.

China does not pay us anything in tariffs! Companies importing Chinese goods do! What a bozo.

I hope you understand that yours is a hoped-for reaction.

If you are less literal, it's a valid statement. We are collecting money from tariffs and it is hurting China. It's an often used ploy for Trump to use small inaccuracies. It deflect criticism from the content to the semantics. Now that you have had your huff, it's too late to bring up the impact on soybean farmers and so on.

J