Also need legal ( financial ) advice for mom's money.

[Papa Deuce]

I may have to see an attorney as well... I mentioned when I came back that my mom has dementia and is living in a nursing home.

Well, we used up all of her money on her care - of the money that I had easy access to. It sure disappears fast at $3000 a month, and it was $4000 when she was actually in the dementia care ward.

So, now I have to sell her "XYZ" stock. Her monthly report shows that she has 300+ digital shares being held by a company, and that she has another 200 shares of actual stock certificates. But I found 300 shares of actual stock certificates. I called the company and they insist that she only has 200 shares in certificates. Looking at the dates, she bought (2) 100 share blocks on the same day, and (1) 100 block on a different day. The 2 certificates from the same day have entirely different numbers on the sheet, indicating that they are in fact, (2) 100 share certificates.

The process to sell these is rather difficult and expensive ( the paper certificates ). They want to charge an administration fee AND a "conversion to digital" fee. They also want me to send the original certificates to them..... this scares me even though this is a HUGE company that I am dealing with.

Thoughts?

I plan to run it by my banker first, and then I will head to my stock broker to see what they say...... but I have bad feelings about this.

[revo]

There's really no other way.

[Lucky]

I'm assuming there is no spouse, and no reasonable hope that she will be moving home after a stay there?

I'm further assuming that what you are doing is spending down her assets (estate) until she qualifies for nursing home benefits. If so, it doesn't matter what it costs to liquidate the stocks. Whatever they net will go to pay for her care, and she'll qualify that much quicker. Remember that she can retain a certain amount for personal needs (don't know what it is now).

People think the government takes your money when you go to the nursing home. They don't. The nursing home is a private enterprise. They charge massive sums, as you found out. The government will provide nursing home care for people, but only if they have no assets. So people have to spend down their assets to qualify.

If there is a husband and wife, and only one needs to go, there is a nifty way you can split the estate to qualify one spouse without spending all the couple's assets.

[Gregg]

I'm assuming there is no spouse, and no reasonable hope that she will be moving home after a stay there?

I'm further assuming that what you are doing is spending down her assets (estate) until she qualifies for nursing home benefits. If so, it doesn't matter what it costs to liquidate the stocks. Whatever they net will go to pay for her care, and she'll qualify that much quicker. Remember that she can retain a certain amount for personal needs (don't know what it is now).

People think the government takes your money when you go to the nursing home. They don't. The nursing home is a private enterprise. They charge massive sums, as you found out. The government will provide nursing home care for people, but only if they have no assets. So people have to spend down their assets to qualify.

If there is a husband and wife, and only one needs to go, there is a nifty way you can split the estate to qualify one spouse without spending all the couple's assets.

We had to do this with my mother (no spouse). We had to liquidate everything convert it to cash and pay the nursing home until it was used up. Then the state took over her health care. I believe she was allowed $200 in an account for needs that was only replenished with her SS checks when needed. The balance going to the home with the state paying the balance. It took about a year and a half to use up all of the assets. She lived in the nursing home for seven years.

One of the first things we needed to liquidate was her condo. It didn't really matter what we got for it as long as it sold. There were some rules attached to the sell price but I do not remember what they were. The intent of the rule/law was to prevent people/family from buying it at too good of a bargain and converting it their own personal gain.

Given the care and longevity that she needed, it would have ruined all of us financially to the point of not being able to care for our own families if we had to try to pay for her care on our own. For us the system was a blessing.

Papa, I am so sorry that you are having to go through this. I hope it all works out well for you and your Mom.

[Hornsby]

My advise is simple: get a lawyer who specializes in long term care issues before you do anything else. There are rules about how much you can gift to your heirs, and all of the other financial mumbo-jumbo. The bottom line is that your Mother and your family don't have to lose everything to the care home owners, you CAN squirrel away a fair amount for her, and your family.

[In the Corn]

My advise is simple: get a lawyer who specializes in long term care issues before you do anything else. There are rules about how much you can gift to your heirs, and all of the other financial mumbo-jumbo. The bottom line is that your Mother and your family don't have to lose everything to the care home owners, you CAN squirrel away a fair amount for her, and your family.

This is not exactly right, as the government can claw back money gifted to families for up to five years. At least that is what my MN attorney friends tell me.

Yes, PD, get together with an attorney ASAP, but ask friends for some suggestions, don't Google search someone that is going to be helping you make these important decisions about your mom and her assets.

[Papa Deuce]

Well, today I had time and I went to see my banker and my broker, and neither were much help, but at least the broker promised to make some calls. The bank said they had nothing to offer. Really I only went to the bank because the banks on the stock certificates were banks that were both bought out by Bank of America.... my bank.

[willthethrill]

Only thing that I can add-Back ~15 years ago when my dad was going through this with his mom, "she" was allowed to give her grandkids a gift prior to liquidating everything, and I think that we each got $100 or something like that. I remember I also got paid for painting her bathroom.

And don't pay for any of the fees or anything out of your pocket. "She" should pay for all of that out of the proceeds.

[Lucky]

ITC is right about the claw back, and will is right about attorney fees being paid out of the estate.

If there is a spouse, a good nursing home care attorney can help you, although if the dementia is severe, that might tie his hands, if she lacks the capacity to execute the various documents.

Be careful about the lawyer you talk to. Not just an estate attorney, but someone who knows and keeps up with nursing home benefits. It changes.